Pls go to NEW (blog site) http://discipleinchrist.blogspot.com/
You can also type : http://DiscipleInChrist.blogspot.com
address is NOT case sensitive & is easier to type, remember, shorter !
We've also moved Discipleship meetings from St Andrew
and meet at : The Assumption of the BVM in Pasadena on Mondays every 2 weeks -- 7PM
(check schedule) Last meeting Aug 3; next at ABVM on August 17 ... etc.
We've added: St Victor Church in West Hollywood -- 2nd Thursday of every month -- 8PM
(check schedule) meeting Aug 6; Sep 10 ... etc.
Tuesday, August 4, 2009
Monday, April 27, 2009
Our greatest gift to Christ -- Take 2!
Bible Stories
April 27, 2009
St. Victor Catholic Church in North Hollywood has started a Discipleship group that meets the second Thursday of each month at 8:00 p.m. The next two meetings are May 14th and June 11th. All are welcome.
Father Paul
The Easter candle is like Christ’s divine light. He shares that with others. Each time someone takes His divine light and lights their own candle, the light of the Easter candle is undimmed. Every time it divides, it is just as light; yet, there are a lot more lights that are lit. Each time you come [to Christ], you can take as much as you want. No matter how much light we take, there is always more!
The topic last Thursday at St. Victor’s was “What is Discipleship?” Several who attended that meeting were at this Discipleship meeting. Father Paul asked if someone from St. Victor’s would talk about what was discussed regarding discipleship.
Andrew
We are called to make Disciples of all nations, to make them other Christs.
Father Paul
Does that sound impossible, or really impossible?
Brian
Depends on who is doing the work. No other institution has lasted this long. It is like a musical note. If it stands alone, it doesn’t do much. You can’t create a key signature. You put two notes together, and you have harmony created between them. They are different harmonies coming together. It is like the Holy Spirit coming together with the Father and the Son, which is much like us coming together in this world.
Father Paul
I was speaking to a person today. They were very excited about this intimate personal encounter with Jesus. But, she really didn’t have a lot of good feelings about structure. What I hear you saying is that when there is structure, it provides a place for the notes to be.
We are talking about the value of relationship. In relationship there can be spirit. I think we can get on safe grounds by saying the longest running relationship is the Trinity. That is a relationship between the Father and the Son, and it is the relationship with the Holy Spirit. In order for God to be encounterable, there must be a structure. Part of that oneness came in a way that was expressed and encountered among us. He came and was always in relationship with the Father. Sometimes it feels like that Spirit, that relationship between two parties, is really what gives value and meaning and makes it all worthwhile. Even though you can’t grab it or manipulate it, it seems very real.
Ethan
There are men and women who are going out. When women are involved, the music is more interesting.
Kenneth
Without wombs, we would not have an incarnate God.
Father Paul
That Spirit of God is invisible, it is attempting to make us into other Christ’s. It has gotten into the human community by those who give an open space for that to occur. They leave a space open.
Brian
It seemed scary to turn others into Christs. It is nice to remember if we can trust, which is the first step, then we can realize how funny it is that we thought it was scary. We can see how possible it really is.
Father Paul
Estrella how does this seem to you?
Estrella
It is like dancing. If we don’t have Christ as a partner, it is not going to work.
Father Paul
What I hear you saying is that if the initial relationship in the family is broken, they can still have access to God. God has a restoring power of relationship of love where all is not well in Paradise.
Jessica
We have to be weak and recognize our weaknesses in order to be strengthened by those in God. We all come from some brokenness. Some may be stronger than others in order to heal. In that way, we are able to be little Christs. It is not us going to this person, but Jesus going to this person and helping in whatever they need. I have been experiencing it. I am doing the craziest things imaginable…after I met Christ. I am a loser for Christ. It is cool being a loser for Christ.
Father Paul
What I hear is that there can be brokenness. God can be there in that. There is something about recognizing our imperfectness which actually can be a really, really wonderful thing.
Louise
I was thinking about how we come to God as a needy child. With God everything is so simple. He heals us.
Nicholas
Maybe people could share their own personal stories and encounters.
Josie
Everyday I’m in continuous, spontaneous prayer. I like to always think of God on my everyday experience, and experience our Lord. We have so much to learn about our church and our faith. Every day I can pick up something new, I don’t need to watch TV.
Alex
I’m not sure where I am, but I ask the Lord to help me. I wasn’t going to come, but I know that God was calling me to be here.
Laura
I have no clue what’s going on. I hoped there was books and no talking, but now everybody is talking! I was walking my dog, and Josie was walking her dog and we started speaking. All I heard was, “Do you know what time confession is?” I thought, If that’s not the grace of God, and I’m just happy to be here.
Demetria
I’m searching for a deeper communion with Jesus
Bob
I’ve been retired for about 5 years, but I’ve wanted to serve since I’ve retired. I serve at a soup kitchen and at the parish ministry.
Robert
I’ve been going steady, but not getting where I want to be, but I’m longing for a closer relationship with God.
Father Paul
That translates into becoming God, because when you’re in relationship with someone you become that. You mutually become a new order of being, but not necessarily each other. We’re making it up as we go along. (Laughter)
Kristin
I missed the meeting on Easter Monday because I was in chains in prison. I spent six days at the gates of Hell, and so I catechized there and helped some amazing women. The point is that this is Christ’s work. It’s not the place or the way I would have thought, or chosen, to do Christ's work. I wanted very much, expected, and asked Our Lord to make it possible, to be here with you. At the same time, I reassured Him I was willing, content and happy to do whatever He preferred -- His Will His Way. So, He blessed me with another sort of Discipleship that Easter Monday night -- one I could not possibly have chosen or ever thought myself worthy or capable of -- but it clearly wasn't me -- it was entirely Him -- His doing -- His Will. Ultimately, that is what this exercise is all about. We were all still together in Christ.
Patricia
I’m amazed and determined. Amazed because I received a blessing from Father Paul. I wasn’t a big believer in hearing people talk about the Holy Spirit, but when I was in the room with you and with my eyes closed, I saw a white light and almost saw an outline of Jesus…and determined to remain in this union
Father Paul
We have a responsibility to cooperate with what God is doing in us…looking for a trust factor.
Scottie
I feel confused on how to evangelize or not to, or how to talk to people about God and your experience and share your relationship. I’m in philosophy class, and it gets confusing…am I supposed to be nice or harsh?
Stacy
Nice. (Laughter) He’s like a brother to me. Father thank you. I feel like I’m at home. I love adoration. I’m Egyptian, and we cover our heads whether Christian or Muslim, and it’s more simple just like St. Therese…keep it simple. I just started learning about our faith a year ago. Our Blessed Mother is our mother. I’m staying home because this faith is so rich. I just met Scottie a week ago, and I told him he’s my brother….so happy to be home. I saw Muslims in Egypt who sacrificed themselves blowing up buildings and going against the government who is pro-American. I’m just so happy to know Jesus, because there are so many souls who are misled. It’s a blessing to be born Catholic.
Kenneth
I’m unique in my spiritual history. I was raised in a very Protestant family. I stopped going to church and became a legit pagan. I started feeling like monotheism was the truth and was led to the Catholic Church, and it was tough, but it was a long interesting journey.
Brian
I feel a little bit anxious but that’s ok. I just love God, and hope that I never forget that; and he always gives me what I need.
Mylene
I’m so overwhelmed right now [and] very high-strung. I feel like I’m in a constant struggle with what I want and what I need and praying that what I need is what I want. I’m so grateful to have this [group].
Sister Sheila
I feel like I love God and that I have a lot to learn.
Tabatha
I feel like I’m in a place of surrender and acceptance. It’s like Jesus is a dentist. He exposes what needs to be healed, the poison, before it gets better. My spirituality is very weak. I’m like a tree that keeps getting blown around with no roots attached to hold me in place. I had a vision like I was going into the ground and my arms were digging in the dirt to put roots down, but I wasn’t getting anywhere. But then the vision changed that I fell asleep and drifted down into the ground. I was being pulled to the center of the earth where the Trinity was. If I can get there I’ll be ok. I’m spiritually napping and letting God grow the roots.
Kenneth
So, you are under anesthesia and napping while the dentist works. (Laughter)
Anna
I usually don’t talk in front of people. Father Paul discovered me. He came to bless my house, and ever since then I haven’t let go. Sometimes I struggle, but I feel like God really wants me. And sometimes it’s hard for me to let go. But I see Tabatha struggling, and I know that I’m not alone.
Ethan
I am just very thankful to be here in all of your presence. I feel the Jesus in all of you, and in me. It stirs it up in me. Thank you for loving Him.
Gabriella
I felt like Father came to my house and called my daughter. I felt his love pull her in a lot. My heart is coming out. I saw Jesus. I felt like Jesus was very thirsty. I was telling people to give him water to drink. I went to his feet and cried at his feet. Jesus came down and said, “Eat my flesh and drink my blood.” During Holy Thursday, my heart was just pounding. [I said] Jesus you are with me. Thank you. Thank you.
Phyllis
I have been Catholic for almost a year. I came from Lutheran faith. I am amazed at what an awesome God we serve. I am just amazed with Christ.
Lorena (mother)
I have four children. I am just jumping here and there too trying to learn about God.
Lorena (daughter)
I am just doing what she does.
Martha
I met Father Paul about a month after he became a priest. Someone said certain priests have different gifts. I was in the back and hadn’t met him. You could tell the Holy Spirit was so strong with him. You could see a change in him before mass and after. You could see the Holy Spirit. I can feel the strength of the Holy Spirit. There are hearts beating. I have been in the charismatic movement for 10 years, and I know nothing.
I can feel the Holy Spirit moving in this room. It is going to work in you. I am feeling this and sharing it. I cannot contain it. The Lord is with you very, very strongly. Thank God we can say, “Alleluia,” now that Lent is over! I am grateful we can say that. I go to the Easter Vigil. It is beautiful to come to a place and say, “Alleluia.” We can receive our Sacraments. We can be an example. Pray for the kids who are making their first penance. It is beautiful. I know there are questions you guys have. Thank you for putting this together. My heart is in my throat because I can feel your joy. I have chills because some of you are so happy.
Tyree
I have been Catholic all my life. For me, the lesson of the day is to hope in the Lord. To hope in a man who lived and died and continues to live. That is why I come here, to learn to hope in Jesus Christ the Son, Jesus Christ the God, Jesus Christ the Spirit. That is what I am hoping for. I don’t know how it’s all going to come out.
Krissy
I am feeling tested. I won’t learn my lesson. I have challenges in all areas of my life. I can’t seem to trust God when I have to. He hopes I will turn to him. I am glad to be here.
Andrew
I am hopeful and I am afraid. I am afraid to be vulnerable, to open myself up to God. But I am hopeful that if I do, cool things are gonna’ happen.
Nicholas
I think I am in love with Scottie’s sister! (Roaring laughter)
I relate to her in that I was going to an Episcopal church. In a certain situation, you might feel more safe; especially during Eucharist. I never felt it.
Mando
Do you want to be a nun? (Laughter)
Nicholas
I hope it is real. I went on a personal retreat at St. Andrew’s Abbey. That is how I celebrated finishing graduate work. That was the logical place to go and let loose. (Laughter) I intellectualize a lot. I wanted to introduce “me” to it all. They were real people with real problems. I met a Brother Cassian there, and I ran into Ethan there. We met in passing, and I said, “Whatever…let me finish my vacation.” I spoke to Brother Cassian. He connected me with Father Paul. I got back in touch with Ethan, and a lot of profoundly bad things have happened (laughter) …and I don’t care. I got in a car wreck. I wasn’t even a block from my friend’s house. I had a witness, and I am getting a new car. I went to this monastery and said, “This is it!” I don’t want to make Father Paul into a mini-god, but he seems to be in a place that is similar to me. I am feeling a grace I cannot see or communicate. I recently read a book and it spoke to me and got me beyond just having faith to a place that I can see morals and what they mean.
Krystal
I think this group has helped me a lot with my faith. When I finally did confirmation, it lit me on fire. I wanted to learn more and feel more. Once you start learning about God, and knowing Him, things that would never have bothered me, hurt me. It hurts God. I am found in God. I have been tested a lot. When I feel lost, it is when I am far from God. I am the one who is far from Him.
Chris
I missed the initial question…
Father Paul
I think we all did! (Laughter) What is my way of being? Or, whatever.
Chris
My way of being…I guess what I think of…I can relate to the movies brought in. I watched The Bells of St Mary’s . One of the girls is asked to bring five senses together. She has them wrong. She adds ”to be’… to be present and to be who we are in God. She related it to Hamlet. To be or not to be. For me, to be, to be present as possible to God and my relationship to Him. I am being asked to trust in my life, my future, my finances; knowing He is going to take care of everything. All that has happened and will happen is in Him.
Rosemarie
I am amazed and transformed. The last two weeks has been difficult. My best friend’s daughter is getting married. Finally, with wrestling with this trip. I went on my knees and just fell asleep. The Lord told me He would be with me on the trip. My friends are protestants. I told the Lord if He wanted this to be a trip of evangelizing, it will be.
Joe
My way of being, I think I am greedy and ambitious. I want to learn and be exposed to as many things as possible. I came because I checked out four DVD’s last time. I am a cradle Catholic. I realize that I have been making good excuses that I have no male role model. Psychologically, that stuck with me for a long time. A few years ago, I let it go and forgave my father. The whole time I have a pretty good role model, in Jesus. And I watch these movies on the saints. They are like rock stars! When I come out of James Bond…I can be James Bond. When I see movies about St. Francis, I am so charged up. I just want to love as much as possible.
Father Paul
Why is this called the “Acts of Apostles?”
Someone responded that the Acts of the Apostles is an actual continuation of Jesus. We are supposed to make other Christs. We have a continuation of one Christ in others bodies.
We read Acts of the Apostles Chapter 4: 8-12
“Then Peter, filled with the Holy Spirit, answered them, ‘Leaders of the people and elders:
If we are being examined today about a good deed done to a cripple, namely, by what means he was saved,
then all of you and all the people of Israel should know that it was in the name of Jesus Christ the Nazarean whom you crucified, whom God raised from the dead; in his name this man stands before you healed.
He is 'the stone rejected by you, the builders, which has become the cornerstone.'
There is no salvation through anyone else, nor is there any other name under heaven given to the human race by which we are to be saved’."
Stacy
It takes me back to the Middle East. There is no salvation except through Jesus Christ. There it is. Again, I just thank Jesus.
Brian
I was kinda’ confused last night. I was opened to being helped and being held. I was confused about who was there wanting to hold me. And I know there are other things out there that I don’t know about. I knew I needed to be held. I tried to listen and prayed to know that you [God] are going to take hold of me and then He took care of me. It came from saying, “I am open to everything, but I need you.”
Gabriel
His love is so powerful He can heal our brokenness. I think about my own failings in life. I know God the Father in Jesus Christ is calling for me to be healed.
Next reading: First Letter of John Chapter 3: 1-2
“See what love the Father has bestowed on us that we may be called the children of God. Yet so we are. The reason the world does not know us is that it did not know him. Beloved, we are God’s children now; what we shall be has not yet been revealed. We do know that when it is revealed we shall be like Him, for we shall see Him as He is.”
Patricia
I have done so much for my family. Now, I am doing everything for the name of Jesus, for the name of God. I am living for God and everything He stands for.
Father
How did you get like this?
Patricia
Partly because I met you [Father Paul], and because I opened the door completely letting all emotions, fear mix in with God and see how it worked. I was in a car wreck too. I am saving up for my house, and I just said, “Ok.” I know if I hadn’t been in this state of mind…all is well.
Stacy
I wanted to comment about going to God all imperfect. He just loves us so much that He accepts us. That is why He is on the cross.
Father Paul
I get so happy when I hear someone say, “I am lost or just beginning.” Jesus is so grateful when we just show Him where we are. He gives us grace and strength that He helps us open up these places that are worse. He goes deeper and deeper. The contemplative prayer is the way we allow Him to go deeper and deeper and heal those places.
Alex
“See what love the Father has bestowed on us.” I just keep thinking of the love God has for us. He wants to be in the garbage with us. Even in my thoughts, if they are not good, he wants to be there with me. When I was in a negative thought, I invited Him to come into it. He transformed it. He is not afraid to enter into something that is not of Him. He transforms it.
Father Paul
There are people who have been praying for years and are just as unknowing. You cannot even count the hours. Christ wants us to forever be beginners. Any time He touches us, it is a small comparison to what the whole realm is. I was talking to someone who is one of those people. He is the guy giving the retreat for the monks at Valyermo. He was asking, “What do you do when you get into prayer and it feels like grace is coming in? What do you do with the part that is fighting it. How is one to be with that…to allow Christ to move through. Allow Christ to come in with all that?” Anything that is unhealthy energy, He takes into Himself. That gets tamed to another whole level. We just trust and stay in that zone. It is the same thing we are dong; the same thing this guy is doing. I connect my lostness with someone else’s lostness. Jesus says He thinks He’s got enough. You know the fighting doesn’t work. A new person will start to open to you, but you know you have nothing to give. You get used to Christ being in the middle of all that mess. You are both opening up to Christ. He honors that communion and comes in and heals. I am the same, but Christ is happy to be with loneliness and lostness.
Bethany
The way Alex invited God into our bad thoughts. The natural thoughts of negativity is shame. I think shame is the worst thing that can come into your spiritual life. Shame makes you hide…like Adam and Eve. My natural response is to feel the shame and hide.
Joe
What we just read, for me, taking ourselves as literal “children of God.” It may be hard to believe. Since I have made God the Father my Father, I am making it like He is my earthly father. So many don’t make him our father. That is why they are so far from me. My family knows my scars, and illnesses. The more we make the Father our earthly father, the better it is for us. The King of Kings is our earthly father. He has our back covered!
Sister Sheila
In that shame, I have discovered going to Mary because she has a tender heart and is open to the Holy Spirit. What we block, she can help us open us. She helps with what we block.
Stacy
Sometimes it is hard to accept “Beloved,” that there is someone who loves us unconditionally. The word in itself is so beautiful.
Patrick
In regards to shame, my life and my beliefs were opposite. I would go to Mass and leave because my sin brought shame to me. Over a month ago, I said I would give up everything. I wouldn’t even pray. He reached out to me in my agony and changed my life 360 degrees. Maybe even though you don’t reach out to Him, He still reaches out to you. One day, I let it out, and that was it! God has intervened in my life.
Father Paul
Talking about the word “Beloved,” we had to write a letter to God and then write what God would be writing to me. I only got to two words…Dear Paul. That is that word “Beloved.” Somehow we have to get that…that’s what gets us a marker on the board of these experiences. When God is saying, “Beloved” and He is not talking to the person next to us.
Ethan
“See what love the Father has bestowed on us that we may be called the children of God.” This comes back to Ephesians. He is giving us Heaven so we can be called the children of God.
Father Paul
I cannot become “Beloved” or have an act of the “Beloved ones.” I have to be in union with the others He is calling “Beloved.” I can’t really get it until we get it together. It’s about all of it together. He is not alive until the rest of His body comes together. St. Paul says, “I want to be with Christ only if the others are with Christ.”
Brian
I don’t even understand what St Paul said…I don’t want to be with Christ.
Father Paul
Let’s go to Romans 9: 1-3
“I speak the truth in Christ, I do not lie; my conscience joins with the holy Spirit in bearing me witness
that I have great sorrow and constant anguish in my heart.
For I could wish that I myself were accursed and separated from Christ for the sake of my brothers, my kin according to the flesh.”
Father Paul
That is Jesus’ own longing in St. Paul.
Reading: John 10:11-18
“I am the good shepherd. A good shepherd lays down his life for the sheep. A hired man, who is not a shepherd and whose sheep are not his own, sees a wolf coming and leaves the sheep and runs away, and the wolf catches and scatters them. This is because he works for pay and has no concern for the sheep. I am the good shepherd, and I know mine and mine know me, just as the Father knows me and I know the Father; and I will lay down my life for the sheep. I have other sheep that do not belong to this fold. These also I must lead, and they will hear my voice, and there will be one flock, one shepherd. This is why the Father loves me, because I lay down my life in order to take it up again. No one takes it from me, but I lay it down on my own. I have power to lay it down, and power to take it up again. This command I have received from my Father."
Tyree
Wow! (Laughter) He goes right to the heart of it, right to the center.
Stacy
I get confused. The Father, is He a Spirit, a person?
Father Paul
Yes.
Three persons in One God. A communion of persons.
Kenneth
There is such a perfect outpouring of love and self and will that is perfectly reflected by the Son. So perfect, that relationship became its own person. Is that the Holy Spirit?
Father Paul
Yes. The Father can only pour Himself out if there is a person who is open to completely receive. If you can only pour out half of it, and that person can only receive half, then God can only be half of who He receives. The Son received all of what the Father is. Part of the Father is the Son who is open to outpouring in reality of His Father, and now He will have nothing but the Father in Him and now all you can do is pour out completely who you are. St. Paul said he needed his brothers to be woken up in communion for me to be who I am. Our greatest gift for Christ is not what we do for Him…but what He can do for us. I was asking God, “How can I thank you for all you have given me?” [He said,] “The only way you can thank me is to be open to receive more. I get so thrilled with that. And if you want to thank me again,….you know what’s next.” Then you have this outpouring. You are just looking for a place for this to go. You are looking for others who will receive.
Stacy
The Father just existed.
Father Paul
With a big “E.” He is supporting everything in being. It is not imaginable. It is beyond a “thing”
The fun part I like, ”I have the power to lay it down.” He is doing this only because He is God Himself. We get naive [by saying that] I am going empty myself. You are still doing the emptying. You do not have the power to empty yourself. Christ himself infuses us with His own power that He has to lay down His life. We go so far, and then it gets embarrassing. Christ gives us His own being. Christ says He will come into all that with you. His life is the Divine Trinity. If we allow Him, He will lay down His life within us. We don’t worry about not being perfect. I can’t be nice. I can’t fast perfectly. He lets us try so that we may become humble. You will be more disposed before you take over again. [Christ says] it will be an on-going resignation to my presence and my being in you. That is a poverty of spirit. Blessed are the poor in spirit…because you are allowing God’s own spirit to wed with your spirit. The Kingdom of God will be in us, the two become one. We continually yield to Him. Christ had to continually learn how to be wed in a complementary union with the Father.
It is cheating in a good way if you have this disposition and child-like place and then cheat to allow God to add the Eucharist. It just puts it into light speed. Jesus in the Eucharist says, “I will help you. I will do the dying for you. Oh, you need a little more relationship, I can give you more of that.” The more we rest, the more we sleep and the more we let him in those places. It is all there in Christ. As we yield to that activity, we allow Christ’s intensified presence in us. All prayer is participation in Christ’s own prayer He implants in us. Our inner being moves in that Divine dance. Our own being moves in that Divine way…moving and consecrating. This might be a way to get back this game that is out of control.
Patricia told the story that she heard a homily that they put inferred cameras in on patients in the hospital. The colors on the camera were dark when they were sick. When the patients received the Eucharist, they radiated and they were light. This light came out of them and completely changed those colors.
Father Paul
Jesus is really Jesus…but the activation in participation is up to us. The switch is up to us. The pope had an Encyclical about the Eucharist. Christ needs us to allow an access so relationship can be mutual. It frees us to participate more. Christ wants us to be open and vulnerable during communion. He wants to receive within us, His own self.
By His grace and gift, we are activated by His grace and gift in us. We participate. That is why Christ could not become man unless there was a gift of grace, of Christ on the cross, Mary. She could not have done it as a creature. She needed a divine grace that was given to her in advance of Christ on the cross.
God was God…always. He also became creation. When Christ died, He saved everybody from sin. He took all sin into himself…even Mary’s preemptively. She was given an advanced payment of the grace.
Next Discipleship Meeting:
Monday, May 11, 2009 @ 7pm
St. Andrew’s school conference room
April 27, 2009
St. Victor Catholic Church in North Hollywood has started a Discipleship group that meets the second Thursday of each month at 8:00 p.m. The next two meetings are May 14th and June 11th. All are welcome.
Father Paul
The Easter candle is like Christ’s divine light. He shares that with others. Each time someone takes His divine light and lights their own candle, the light of the Easter candle is undimmed. Every time it divides, it is just as light; yet, there are a lot more lights that are lit. Each time you come [to Christ], you can take as much as you want. No matter how much light we take, there is always more!
The topic last Thursday at St. Victor’s was “What is Discipleship?” Several who attended that meeting were at this Discipleship meeting. Father Paul asked if someone from St. Victor’s would talk about what was discussed regarding discipleship.
Andrew
We are called to make Disciples of all nations, to make them other Christs.
Father Paul
Does that sound impossible, or really impossible?
Brian
Depends on who is doing the work. No other institution has lasted this long. It is like a musical note. If it stands alone, it doesn’t do much. You can’t create a key signature. You put two notes together, and you have harmony created between them. They are different harmonies coming together. It is like the Holy Spirit coming together with the Father and the Son, which is much like us coming together in this world.
Father Paul
I was speaking to a person today. They were very excited about this intimate personal encounter with Jesus. But, she really didn’t have a lot of good feelings about structure. What I hear you saying is that when there is structure, it provides a place for the notes to be.
We are talking about the value of relationship. In relationship there can be spirit. I think we can get on safe grounds by saying the longest running relationship is the Trinity. That is a relationship between the Father and the Son, and it is the relationship with the Holy Spirit. In order for God to be encounterable, there must be a structure. Part of that oneness came in a way that was expressed and encountered among us. He came and was always in relationship with the Father. Sometimes it feels like that Spirit, that relationship between two parties, is really what gives value and meaning and makes it all worthwhile. Even though you can’t grab it or manipulate it, it seems very real.
Ethan
There are men and women who are going out. When women are involved, the music is more interesting.
Kenneth
Without wombs, we would not have an incarnate God.
Father Paul
That Spirit of God is invisible, it is attempting to make us into other Christ’s. It has gotten into the human community by those who give an open space for that to occur. They leave a space open.
Brian
It seemed scary to turn others into Christs. It is nice to remember if we can trust, which is the first step, then we can realize how funny it is that we thought it was scary. We can see how possible it really is.
Father Paul
Estrella how does this seem to you?
Estrella
It is like dancing. If we don’t have Christ as a partner, it is not going to work.
Father Paul
What I hear you saying is that if the initial relationship in the family is broken, they can still have access to God. God has a restoring power of relationship of love where all is not well in Paradise.
Jessica
We have to be weak and recognize our weaknesses in order to be strengthened by those in God. We all come from some brokenness. Some may be stronger than others in order to heal. In that way, we are able to be little Christs. It is not us going to this person, but Jesus going to this person and helping in whatever they need. I have been experiencing it. I am doing the craziest things imaginable…after I met Christ. I am a loser for Christ. It is cool being a loser for Christ.
Father Paul
What I hear is that there can be brokenness. God can be there in that. There is something about recognizing our imperfectness which actually can be a really, really wonderful thing.
Louise
I was thinking about how we come to God as a needy child. With God everything is so simple. He heals us.
Nicholas
Maybe people could share their own personal stories and encounters.
Josie
Everyday I’m in continuous, spontaneous prayer. I like to always think of God on my everyday experience, and experience our Lord. We have so much to learn about our church and our faith. Every day I can pick up something new, I don’t need to watch TV.
Alex
I’m not sure where I am, but I ask the Lord to help me. I wasn’t going to come, but I know that God was calling me to be here.
Laura
I have no clue what’s going on. I hoped there was books and no talking, but now everybody is talking! I was walking my dog, and Josie was walking her dog and we started speaking. All I heard was, “Do you know what time confession is?” I thought, If that’s not the grace of God, and I’m just happy to be here.
Demetria
I’m searching for a deeper communion with Jesus
Bob
I’ve been retired for about 5 years, but I’ve wanted to serve since I’ve retired. I serve at a soup kitchen and at the parish ministry.
Robert
I’ve been going steady, but not getting where I want to be, but I’m longing for a closer relationship with God.
Father Paul
That translates into becoming God, because when you’re in relationship with someone you become that. You mutually become a new order of being, but not necessarily each other. We’re making it up as we go along. (Laughter)
Kristin
I missed the meeting on Easter Monday because I was in chains in prison. I spent six days at the gates of Hell, and so I catechized there and helped some amazing women. The point is that this is Christ’s work. It’s not the place or the way I would have thought, or chosen, to do Christ's work. I wanted very much, expected, and asked Our Lord to make it possible, to be here with you. At the same time, I reassured Him I was willing, content and happy to do whatever He preferred -- His Will His Way. So, He blessed me with another sort of Discipleship that Easter Monday night -- one I could not possibly have chosen or ever thought myself worthy or capable of -- but it clearly wasn't me -- it was entirely Him -- His doing -- His Will. Ultimately, that is what this exercise is all about. We were all still together in Christ.
Patricia
I’m amazed and determined. Amazed because I received a blessing from Father Paul. I wasn’t a big believer in hearing people talk about the Holy Spirit, but when I was in the room with you and with my eyes closed, I saw a white light and almost saw an outline of Jesus…and determined to remain in this union
Father Paul
We have a responsibility to cooperate with what God is doing in us…looking for a trust factor.
Scottie
I feel confused on how to evangelize or not to, or how to talk to people about God and your experience and share your relationship. I’m in philosophy class, and it gets confusing…am I supposed to be nice or harsh?
Stacy
Nice. (Laughter) He’s like a brother to me. Father thank you. I feel like I’m at home. I love adoration. I’m Egyptian, and we cover our heads whether Christian or Muslim, and it’s more simple just like St. Therese…keep it simple. I just started learning about our faith a year ago. Our Blessed Mother is our mother. I’m staying home because this faith is so rich. I just met Scottie a week ago, and I told him he’s my brother….so happy to be home. I saw Muslims in Egypt who sacrificed themselves blowing up buildings and going against the government who is pro-American. I’m just so happy to know Jesus, because there are so many souls who are misled. It’s a blessing to be born Catholic.
Kenneth
I’m unique in my spiritual history. I was raised in a very Protestant family. I stopped going to church and became a legit pagan. I started feeling like monotheism was the truth and was led to the Catholic Church, and it was tough, but it was a long interesting journey.
Brian
I feel a little bit anxious but that’s ok. I just love God, and hope that I never forget that; and he always gives me what I need.
Mylene
I’m so overwhelmed right now [and] very high-strung. I feel like I’m in a constant struggle with what I want and what I need and praying that what I need is what I want. I’m so grateful to have this [group].
Sister Sheila
I feel like I love God and that I have a lot to learn.
Tabatha
I feel like I’m in a place of surrender and acceptance. It’s like Jesus is a dentist. He exposes what needs to be healed, the poison, before it gets better. My spirituality is very weak. I’m like a tree that keeps getting blown around with no roots attached to hold me in place. I had a vision like I was going into the ground and my arms were digging in the dirt to put roots down, but I wasn’t getting anywhere. But then the vision changed that I fell asleep and drifted down into the ground. I was being pulled to the center of the earth where the Trinity was. If I can get there I’ll be ok. I’m spiritually napping and letting God grow the roots.
Kenneth
So, you are under anesthesia and napping while the dentist works. (Laughter)
Anna
I usually don’t talk in front of people. Father Paul discovered me. He came to bless my house, and ever since then I haven’t let go. Sometimes I struggle, but I feel like God really wants me. And sometimes it’s hard for me to let go. But I see Tabatha struggling, and I know that I’m not alone.
Ethan
I am just very thankful to be here in all of your presence. I feel the Jesus in all of you, and in me. It stirs it up in me. Thank you for loving Him.
Gabriella
I felt like Father came to my house and called my daughter. I felt his love pull her in a lot. My heart is coming out. I saw Jesus. I felt like Jesus was very thirsty. I was telling people to give him water to drink. I went to his feet and cried at his feet. Jesus came down and said, “Eat my flesh and drink my blood.” During Holy Thursday, my heart was just pounding. [I said] Jesus you are with me. Thank you. Thank you.
Phyllis
I have been Catholic for almost a year. I came from Lutheran faith. I am amazed at what an awesome God we serve. I am just amazed with Christ.
Lorena (mother)
I have four children. I am just jumping here and there too trying to learn about God.
Lorena (daughter)
I am just doing what she does.
Martha
I met Father Paul about a month after he became a priest. Someone said certain priests have different gifts. I was in the back and hadn’t met him. You could tell the Holy Spirit was so strong with him. You could see a change in him before mass and after. You could see the Holy Spirit. I can feel the strength of the Holy Spirit. There are hearts beating. I have been in the charismatic movement for 10 years, and I know nothing.
I can feel the Holy Spirit moving in this room. It is going to work in you. I am feeling this and sharing it. I cannot contain it. The Lord is with you very, very strongly. Thank God we can say, “Alleluia,” now that Lent is over! I am grateful we can say that. I go to the Easter Vigil. It is beautiful to come to a place and say, “Alleluia.” We can receive our Sacraments. We can be an example. Pray for the kids who are making their first penance. It is beautiful. I know there are questions you guys have. Thank you for putting this together. My heart is in my throat because I can feel your joy. I have chills because some of you are so happy.
Tyree
I have been Catholic all my life. For me, the lesson of the day is to hope in the Lord. To hope in a man who lived and died and continues to live. That is why I come here, to learn to hope in Jesus Christ the Son, Jesus Christ the God, Jesus Christ the Spirit. That is what I am hoping for. I don’t know how it’s all going to come out.
Krissy
I am feeling tested. I won’t learn my lesson. I have challenges in all areas of my life. I can’t seem to trust God when I have to. He hopes I will turn to him. I am glad to be here.
Andrew
I am hopeful and I am afraid. I am afraid to be vulnerable, to open myself up to God. But I am hopeful that if I do, cool things are gonna’ happen.
Nicholas
I think I am in love with Scottie’s sister! (Roaring laughter)
I relate to her in that I was going to an Episcopal church. In a certain situation, you might feel more safe; especially during Eucharist. I never felt it.
Mando
Do you want to be a nun? (Laughter)
Nicholas
I hope it is real. I went on a personal retreat at St. Andrew’s Abbey. That is how I celebrated finishing graduate work. That was the logical place to go and let loose. (Laughter) I intellectualize a lot. I wanted to introduce “me” to it all. They were real people with real problems. I met a Brother Cassian there, and I ran into Ethan there. We met in passing, and I said, “Whatever…let me finish my vacation.” I spoke to Brother Cassian. He connected me with Father Paul. I got back in touch with Ethan, and a lot of profoundly bad things have happened (laughter) …and I don’t care. I got in a car wreck. I wasn’t even a block from my friend’s house. I had a witness, and I am getting a new car. I went to this monastery and said, “This is it!” I don’t want to make Father Paul into a mini-god, but he seems to be in a place that is similar to me. I am feeling a grace I cannot see or communicate. I recently read a book and it spoke to me and got me beyond just having faith to a place that I can see morals and what they mean.
Krystal
I think this group has helped me a lot with my faith. When I finally did confirmation, it lit me on fire. I wanted to learn more and feel more. Once you start learning about God, and knowing Him, things that would never have bothered me, hurt me. It hurts God. I am found in God. I have been tested a lot. When I feel lost, it is when I am far from God. I am the one who is far from Him.
Chris
I missed the initial question…
Father Paul
I think we all did! (Laughter) What is my way of being? Or, whatever.
Chris
My way of being…I guess what I think of…I can relate to the movies brought in. I watched The Bells of St Mary’s . One of the girls is asked to bring five senses together. She has them wrong. She adds ”to be’… to be present and to be who we are in God. She related it to Hamlet. To be or not to be. For me, to be, to be present as possible to God and my relationship to Him. I am being asked to trust in my life, my future, my finances; knowing He is going to take care of everything. All that has happened and will happen is in Him.
Rosemarie
I am amazed and transformed. The last two weeks has been difficult. My best friend’s daughter is getting married. Finally, with wrestling with this trip. I went on my knees and just fell asleep. The Lord told me He would be with me on the trip. My friends are protestants. I told the Lord if He wanted this to be a trip of evangelizing, it will be.
Joe
My way of being, I think I am greedy and ambitious. I want to learn and be exposed to as many things as possible. I came because I checked out four DVD’s last time. I am a cradle Catholic. I realize that I have been making good excuses that I have no male role model. Psychologically, that stuck with me for a long time. A few years ago, I let it go and forgave my father. The whole time I have a pretty good role model, in Jesus. And I watch these movies on the saints. They are like rock stars! When I come out of James Bond…I can be James Bond. When I see movies about St. Francis, I am so charged up. I just want to love as much as possible.
Father Paul
Why is this called the “Acts of Apostles?”
Someone responded that the Acts of the Apostles is an actual continuation of Jesus. We are supposed to make other Christs. We have a continuation of one Christ in others bodies.
We read Acts of the Apostles Chapter 4: 8-12
“Then Peter, filled with the Holy Spirit, answered them, ‘Leaders of the people and elders:
If we are being examined today about a good deed done to a cripple, namely, by what means he was saved,
then all of you and all the people of Israel should know that it was in the name of Jesus Christ the Nazarean whom you crucified, whom God raised from the dead; in his name this man stands before you healed.
He is 'the stone rejected by you, the builders, which has become the cornerstone.'
There is no salvation through anyone else, nor is there any other name under heaven given to the human race by which we are to be saved’."
Stacy
It takes me back to the Middle East. There is no salvation except through Jesus Christ. There it is. Again, I just thank Jesus.
Brian
I was kinda’ confused last night. I was opened to being helped and being held. I was confused about who was there wanting to hold me. And I know there are other things out there that I don’t know about. I knew I needed to be held. I tried to listen and prayed to know that you [God] are going to take hold of me and then He took care of me. It came from saying, “I am open to everything, but I need you.”
Gabriel
His love is so powerful He can heal our brokenness. I think about my own failings in life. I know God the Father in Jesus Christ is calling for me to be healed.
Next reading: First Letter of John Chapter 3: 1-2
“See what love the Father has bestowed on us that we may be called the children of God. Yet so we are. The reason the world does not know us is that it did not know him. Beloved, we are God’s children now; what we shall be has not yet been revealed. We do know that when it is revealed we shall be like Him, for we shall see Him as He is.”
Patricia
I have done so much for my family. Now, I am doing everything for the name of Jesus, for the name of God. I am living for God and everything He stands for.
Father
How did you get like this?
Patricia
Partly because I met you [Father Paul], and because I opened the door completely letting all emotions, fear mix in with God and see how it worked. I was in a car wreck too. I am saving up for my house, and I just said, “Ok.” I know if I hadn’t been in this state of mind…all is well.
Stacy
I wanted to comment about going to God all imperfect. He just loves us so much that He accepts us. That is why He is on the cross.
Father Paul
I get so happy when I hear someone say, “I am lost or just beginning.” Jesus is so grateful when we just show Him where we are. He gives us grace and strength that He helps us open up these places that are worse. He goes deeper and deeper. The contemplative prayer is the way we allow Him to go deeper and deeper and heal those places.
Alex
“See what love the Father has bestowed on us.” I just keep thinking of the love God has for us. He wants to be in the garbage with us. Even in my thoughts, if they are not good, he wants to be there with me. When I was in a negative thought, I invited Him to come into it. He transformed it. He is not afraid to enter into something that is not of Him. He transforms it.
Father Paul
There are people who have been praying for years and are just as unknowing. You cannot even count the hours. Christ wants us to forever be beginners. Any time He touches us, it is a small comparison to what the whole realm is. I was talking to someone who is one of those people. He is the guy giving the retreat for the monks at Valyermo. He was asking, “What do you do when you get into prayer and it feels like grace is coming in? What do you do with the part that is fighting it. How is one to be with that…to allow Christ to move through. Allow Christ to come in with all that?” Anything that is unhealthy energy, He takes into Himself. That gets tamed to another whole level. We just trust and stay in that zone. It is the same thing we are dong; the same thing this guy is doing. I connect my lostness with someone else’s lostness. Jesus says He thinks He’s got enough. You know the fighting doesn’t work. A new person will start to open to you, but you know you have nothing to give. You get used to Christ being in the middle of all that mess. You are both opening up to Christ. He honors that communion and comes in and heals. I am the same, but Christ is happy to be with loneliness and lostness.
Bethany
The way Alex invited God into our bad thoughts. The natural thoughts of negativity is shame. I think shame is the worst thing that can come into your spiritual life. Shame makes you hide…like Adam and Eve. My natural response is to feel the shame and hide.
Joe
What we just read, for me, taking ourselves as literal “children of God.” It may be hard to believe. Since I have made God the Father my Father, I am making it like He is my earthly father. So many don’t make him our father. That is why they are so far from me. My family knows my scars, and illnesses. The more we make the Father our earthly father, the better it is for us. The King of Kings is our earthly father. He has our back covered!
Sister Sheila
In that shame, I have discovered going to Mary because she has a tender heart and is open to the Holy Spirit. What we block, she can help us open us. She helps with what we block.
Stacy
Sometimes it is hard to accept “Beloved,” that there is someone who loves us unconditionally. The word in itself is so beautiful.
Patrick
In regards to shame, my life and my beliefs were opposite. I would go to Mass and leave because my sin brought shame to me. Over a month ago, I said I would give up everything. I wouldn’t even pray. He reached out to me in my agony and changed my life 360 degrees. Maybe even though you don’t reach out to Him, He still reaches out to you. One day, I let it out, and that was it! God has intervened in my life.
Father Paul
Talking about the word “Beloved,” we had to write a letter to God and then write what God would be writing to me. I only got to two words…Dear Paul. That is that word “Beloved.” Somehow we have to get that…that’s what gets us a marker on the board of these experiences. When God is saying, “Beloved” and He is not talking to the person next to us.
Ethan
“See what love the Father has bestowed on us that we may be called the children of God.” This comes back to Ephesians. He is giving us Heaven so we can be called the children of God.
Father Paul
I cannot become “Beloved” or have an act of the “Beloved ones.” I have to be in union with the others He is calling “Beloved.” I can’t really get it until we get it together. It’s about all of it together. He is not alive until the rest of His body comes together. St. Paul says, “I want to be with Christ only if the others are with Christ.”
Brian
I don’t even understand what St Paul said…I don’t want to be with Christ.
Father Paul
Let’s go to Romans 9: 1-3
“I speak the truth in Christ, I do not lie; my conscience joins with the holy Spirit in bearing me witness
that I have great sorrow and constant anguish in my heart.
For I could wish that I myself were accursed and separated from Christ for the sake of my brothers, my kin according to the flesh.”
Father Paul
That is Jesus’ own longing in St. Paul.
Reading: John 10:11-18
“I am the good shepherd. A good shepherd lays down his life for the sheep. A hired man, who is not a shepherd and whose sheep are not his own, sees a wolf coming and leaves the sheep and runs away, and the wolf catches and scatters them. This is because he works for pay and has no concern for the sheep. I am the good shepherd, and I know mine and mine know me, just as the Father knows me and I know the Father; and I will lay down my life for the sheep. I have other sheep that do not belong to this fold. These also I must lead, and they will hear my voice, and there will be one flock, one shepherd. This is why the Father loves me, because I lay down my life in order to take it up again. No one takes it from me, but I lay it down on my own. I have power to lay it down, and power to take it up again. This command I have received from my Father."
Tyree
Wow! (Laughter) He goes right to the heart of it, right to the center.
Stacy
I get confused. The Father, is He a Spirit, a person?
Father Paul
Yes.
Three persons in One God. A communion of persons.
Kenneth
There is such a perfect outpouring of love and self and will that is perfectly reflected by the Son. So perfect, that relationship became its own person. Is that the Holy Spirit?
Father Paul
Yes. The Father can only pour Himself out if there is a person who is open to completely receive. If you can only pour out half of it, and that person can only receive half, then God can only be half of who He receives. The Son received all of what the Father is. Part of the Father is the Son who is open to outpouring in reality of His Father, and now He will have nothing but the Father in Him and now all you can do is pour out completely who you are. St. Paul said he needed his brothers to be woken up in communion for me to be who I am. Our greatest gift for Christ is not what we do for Him…but what He can do for us. I was asking God, “How can I thank you for all you have given me?” [He said,] “The only way you can thank me is to be open to receive more. I get so thrilled with that. And if you want to thank me again,….you know what’s next.” Then you have this outpouring. You are just looking for a place for this to go. You are looking for others who will receive.
Stacy
The Father just existed.
Father Paul
With a big “E.” He is supporting everything in being. It is not imaginable. It is beyond a “thing”
The fun part I like, ”I have the power to lay it down.” He is doing this only because He is God Himself. We get naive [by saying that] I am going empty myself. You are still doing the emptying. You do not have the power to empty yourself. Christ himself infuses us with His own power that He has to lay down His life. We go so far, and then it gets embarrassing. Christ gives us His own being. Christ says He will come into all that with you. His life is the Divine Trinity. If we allow Him, He will lay down His life within us. We don’t worry about not being perfect. I can’t be nice. I can’t fast perfectly. He lets us try so that we may become humble. You will be more disposed before you take over again. [Christ says] it will be an on-going resignation to my presence and my being in you. That is a poverty of spirit. Blessed are the poor in spirit…because you are allowing God’s own spirit to wed with your spirit. The Kingdom of God will be in us, the two become one. We continually yield to Him. Christ had to continually learn how to be wed in a complementary union with the Father.
It is cheating in a good way if you have this disposition and child-like place and then cheat to allow God to add the Eucharist. It just puts it into light speed. Jesus in the Eucharist says, “I will help you. I will do the dying for you. Oh, you need a little more relationship, I can give you more of that.” The more we rest, the more we sleep and the more we let him in those places. It is all there in Christ. As we yield to that activity, we allow Christ’s intensified presence in us. All prayer is participation in Christ’s own prayer He implants in us. Our inner being moves in that Divine dance. Our own being moves in that Divine way…moving and consecrating. This might be a way to get back this game that is out of control.
Patricia told the story that she heard a homily that they put inferred cameras in on patients in the hospital. The colors on the camera were dark when they were sick. When the patients received the Eucharist, they radiated and they were light. This light came out of them and completely changed those colors.
Father Paul
Jesus is really Jesus…but the activation in participation is up to us. The switch is up to us. The pope had an Encyclical about the Eucharist. Christ needs us to allow an access so relationship can be mutual. It frees us to participate more. Christ wants us to be open and vulnerable during communion. He wants to receive within us, His own self.
By His grace and gift, we are activated by His grace and gift in us. We participate. That is why Christ could not become man unless there was a gift of grace, of Christ on the cross, Mary. She could not have done it as a creature. She needed a divine grace that was given to her in advance of Christ on the cross.
God was God…always. He also became creation. When Christ died, He saved everybody from sin. He took all sin into himself…even Mary’s preemptively. She was given an advanced payment of the grace.
Next Discipleship Meeting:
Monday, May 11, 2009 @ 7pm
St. Andrew’s school conference room
Our greatest gift to Christ is what we will allow Him to do for us
St. Andrew’s Discipleship & Bible Stories
St Victor’s discipleship on Thursday – a few of our group went and recapped for us: we are called to make disciples of all nations and to make others into other Christos – this is impossible if we are doing it ourselves but if we are working with Christ what is or seems impossible, or scary is accomplished because God does the impossible for and with us.
The value of not just one thing or person but a relationship – there can be a new sort of “spirit” in a relationship
The longest running structured relationship is the Most Holy Trinity – a dynamic structure of intimacy and Love – within God there is a movement, relationship, dynamic, structure – until God came among us and talked about this Trinitarian relationship we couldn’t even begin to imagine it: Christ keeps referring to His relationship : the Father and I are one (not I am God period – there is always the relationship referenced here – if you see Me you see the Father – If I go to the Father, I will send the Holy Spirit … etc.
Relationship is really what gives something a new kind of value and meaning even though you can’t grab it, control it, and manipulate it.
In music if you have one thing standing on its own you don’t have structure but when you put 2 notes together you have harmony and structure – scripture if you have two or more gathered in My Name – also scripture mentions the harmony of notes (Genesis Chapter 1, Matthew 18:19-21)
Just having a base is boring (fun for a while) but if you add in treble and higher notes you have a much more interesting relationship and musical piece.
“It takes two to tango.” Dancing, like music is a good example of the benefits of a relationship.
All is not well in paradise – God can restore Loving relationships that have been broken.
We need to recognize our weaknesses in order to be strengthened in God. Being able to recognize our weakness allows us to heal. Jesus in us approaches others to help them in their need and Jesus in them approaches us to help us in our need.
What is my way of being :
To be and to be present with Him, present to God and trust in Him with my life, future, finances – allow my Faith to be stretched.
There is something about recognizing our imperfectness which can be a really wonderful thing !
We come to Christ like a needy little child. Everything with God is so simple. He bandages and heals our wounds. But everything with God is so simple.
My twins keep me in check by saying: “The Holy Spirit wouldn’t say that.”
We are allowing Christ into the room – allowing Christ to become more real – how He has been pulling and moving and choreographing us in Christ. We get samples of God – we allow Christ to get catches of us and allow Him to start turning us into His Divine Life.
You mutually become a new order of being as this relationship in Christ transforms each of you.
There’s a constant struggle with what I want and what I need and praying to God that what I need becomes what I want !!!
Jesus exposes us like a dentist and spiritually I’m at the dentist right now, and I’m also like a little tree without roots that just blows and blows – I’m trying to plant roots and getting nowhere and then I finally just rested and went to sleep and suddenly all the roots were growing strong – a little tree that keeps re-transplanting – He’s calling me to nap spiritually – Christ is the dentist with anesthesia – while I am struggling to set down roots
The stakes keep getting greater for us to exercise our trust and Hope in God more.
It always happens that way. Just when you find the one and only they want to become a nun. I was going to the Episcopal Church because they were more liberal but I never felt Christ’s Presence especially during the services and something always took me back to the Catholic Church and now I’m considering a Vocation. A lot of profoundly negative things have happened. The Episcopal church really misses the boat on morals and what they mean in our lives.
Things that would not have bothered me so much before bother me very much now.
I am found in God; God is never far from me but I allow things to take me far from God.
Acts 4:8-12 actual continuation of Jesus – we are to make other Christos – one Christ in other bodies
8 Then Peter, filled with the Holy Ghost, said to them: Ye princes of the people, and ancients, hear: 9 If we this day are examined concerning the good deed done to the infirm man, by what means he hath been made whole: 10 Be it known to you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom you crucified, whom God hath raised from the dead, even by him this man stands here before you whole.
11 This is the stone which was rejected by you the builders, which is become the head of the corner. 12 Neither is there salvation in any other. For there is no other name under heaven given to men, whereby we must be saved.
God’s Love is so powerful that He can heal broken souls – we think of our own failings and know that Jesus Christ is calling for us to be healed.
1 Jn 3:1-2 See what Love the Father has bestowed on us, that we may be called the children of God the reason that the world does not know us is because the world did not know Him …
1 Behold what manner of charity the Father hath bestowed upon us, that we should be called, and should be the sons of God. Therefore the world knoweth not us, because it knew not him. 2 Dearly beloved, we are now the sons of God; and it hath not yet appeared what we shall be. We know, that, when he shall appear, we shall be like to him: because we shall see him as he is.
Christ enters into the place of brokenness and confusion and darkness. He opens up the next level of denial and garbage and allows us to feel so secure that we can open up the wound and go into the darkness and unlock those chambers while we are resting and remove the poison/garbage at each level – we allow Christ to take whatever is unhealthy and Christ removes the rot and does the doing. We stay in that zone until He goes in and tames the roots.
Christ wants us forever to be little beginners; the measure between God and us is INFINITE.
All these people are having the exactly the same kinds of experiences. We are His Beloved. The word “Beloved” in itself is so beautiful.
Romans 9:1-3 “There is no monkey crazier than St Paul.” (Yup. That is a direct quote from Fr Paul G)
St Paul goes really insane. I’m dead on. – I speak the Truth in Christ. My … I have great sorrow and constant anguish. Separated from my brothers. Christ cannot Live without coming alive in the one next to you !
1 I speak the truth in Christ, I lie not, my conscience bearing me witness in the Holy Ghost: 2 That I have great sadness, and continual sorrow in my heart. 3 For I wished myself to be an anathema from Christ, for my brethren, who are my kinsmen according to the flesh,
Jn 10: 11-18
11 I am the good shepherd. The good shepherd gives his life for his sheep. 12 But the hireling, and he that is not the shepherd, whose own the sheep are not, sees the wolf coming, and leaves the sheep, and flees: and the wolf catches, and scatters the sheep: 13 And the hireling flees, because he is a hireling: and he hath no care for the sheep. 14 I am the good shepherd; and I know mine, and mine know me. 15 As the Father knows me, and I know the Father: and I lay down my life for my sheep.
16 And other sheep I have, that are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice, and there shall be one fold and one shepherd. 17 Therefore doth the Father love me: because I lay down my life, that I may take it again. 18 No man takes it away from me: but I lay it down of myself, and I have power to lay it down: and I have power to take it up again. This commandment have I received of my Father.
I Am the Good Shepherd … I lay down My Life for My sheep. St Paul got this “crazy” Love from Jesus Who got it from the Father so we have a crazy family… The hireling sees the wolf coming and runs away… because He works for pay. I know Mine and Mine know Me. Jesus knows how Beloved He is of the Father. The two of them are coming into intimate union, communion over and over. You are just as Beloved to me as I Am beloved by My Heavenly Father and I want you to become just as beloved of Me. He who works for pay and has no concern for the sheep. Just as I know the Father and the Father knows Me. I will lay down My Life for the sheep. Other sheep I have that are not of This Fold. This is why the Father Loves Me. I have power to lay My Life down and the power to take it up again. This command I have received from My Father.
St Paul: I need my brothers, sisters [others] to come into this union with me or I will never be who I am !
Our greatest gift to Christ is what we will allow Him to do for us.
All we can do is receive. Be open to receive more. Anything else is an insult. I get so thrilled with that. Open yourself to receive more. Be a place to receive.
Only God Himself has the power to lay down His Life. You can’t, you don’t have the power to empty yourself. Christ Himself infuses His power – that He alone has – to lay down our life – let it be My power – My activity combined with your willingness to let this [contemplative] stuff go on – than lay down your life. We don’t have to worry about the fact that I can’t be a good person, can’t pray, can’t do anything much. “I live now, not I, but Christ in me.” (Galatians 2:20)
Humility – I really can’t do it. Guess what. You have a little bit more humility now, so allow Me to enter in. An ongoing resignation, spirit of resignation to My Presence, My Divinity – Poverty of Spirit – an on-going resignation to let Christ work. Allowing God’s Holy Spirit to wed our spirit – two becoming one, Allowing the Holy Spirit to overshadow us.
All prayer is Christ’s own prayer so that our capacity to move in Divine ways and our inner being moves and consecrates – time to open the secret passages.
Just the physical Presence of God Himself is not enough – He needs us to allow an access so that the relationship is mutual. He then frees more of us to participate. Christ wants us to become integrated. Christ wants us to be vulnerable, exposed (not compartmentalized) to Him. He receives from within us His own self. We are activated by His grace and we participate.
Christ could not become Man unless there was a Gift – a Supernatural Grace given by Christ on the Cross – an advance on the allowance – the Blessed Virgin Mary could not have done Her work as the Mother of God only as a creature (by or according to human nature) – she needed a unique Divine (Supernatural/Sanctifying) Grace. She is full of grace: She is The Immaculate Conception.
St Victor’s discipleship on Thursday – a few of our group went and recapped for us: we are called to make disciples of all nations and to make others into other Christos – this is impossible if we are doing it ourselves but if we are working with Christ what is or seems impossible, or scary is accomplished because God does the impossible for and with us.
The value of not just one thing or person but a relationship – there can be a new sort of “spirit” in a relationship
The longest running structured relationship is the Most Holy Trinity – a dynamic structure of intimacy and Love – within God there is a movement, relationship, dynamic, structure – until God came among us and talked about this Trinitarian relationship we couldn’t even begin to imagine it: Christ keeps referring to His relationship : the Father and I are one (not I am God period – there is always the relationship referenced here – if you see Me you see the Father – If I go to the Father, I will send the Holy Spirit … etc.
Relationship is really what gives something a new kind of value and meaning even though you can’t grab it, control it, and manipulate it.
In music if you have one thing standing on its own you don’t have structure but when you put 2 notes together you have harmony and structure – scripture if you have two or more gathered in My Name – also scripture mentions the harmony of notes (Genesis Chapter 1, Matthew 18:19-21)
Just having a base is boring (fun for a while) but if you add in treble and higher notes you have a much more interesting relationship and musical piece.
“It takes two to tango.” Dancing, like music is a good example of the benefits of a relationship.
All is not well in paradise – God can restore Loving relationships that have been broken.
We need to recognize our weaknesses in order to be strengthened in God. Being able to recognize our weakness allows us to heal. Jesus in us approaches others to help them in their need and Jesus in them approaches us to help us in our need.
What is my way of being :
To be and to be present with Him, present to God and trust in Him with my life, future, finances – allow my Faith to be stretched.
There is something about recognizing our imperfectness which can be a really wonderful thing !
We come to Christ like a needy little child. Everything with God is so simple. He bandages and heals our wounds. But everything with God is so simple.
My twins keep me in check by saying: “The Holy Spirit wouldn’t say that.”
We are allowing Christ into the room – allowing Christ to become more real – how He has been pulling and moving and choreographing us in Christ. We get samples of God – we allow Christ to get catches of us and allow Him to start turning us into His Divine Life.
You mutually become a new order of being as this relationship in Christ transforms each of you.
There’s a constant struggle with what I want and what I need and praying to God that what I need becomes what I want !!!
Jesus exposes us like a dentist and spiritually I’m at the dentist right now, and I’m also like a little tree without roots that just blows and blows – I’m trying to plant roots and getting nowhere and then I finally just rested and went to sleep and suddenly all the roots were growing strong – a little tree that keeps re-transplanting – He’s calling me to nap spiritually – Christ is the dentist with anesthesia – while I am struggling to set down roots
The stakes keep getting greater for us to exercise our trust and Hope in God more.
It always happens that way. Just when you find the one and only they want to become a nun. I was going to the Episcopal Church because they were more liberal but I never felt Christ’s Presence especially during the services and something always took me back to the Catholic Church and now I’m considering a Vocation. A lot of profoundly negative things have happened. The Episcopal church really misses the boat on morals and what they mean in our lives.
Things that would not have bothered me so much before bother me very much now.
I am found in God; God is never far from me but I allow things to take me far from God.
Acts 4:8-12 actual continuation of Jesus – we are to make other Christos – one Christ in other bodies
8 Then Peter, filled with the Holy Ghost, said to them: Ye princes of the people, and ancients, hear: 9 If we this day are examined concerning the good deed done to the infirm man, by what means he hath been made whole: 10 Be it known to you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom you crucified, whom God hath raised from the dead, even by him this man stands here before you whole.
11 This is the stone which was rejected by you the builders, which is become the head of the corner. 12 Neither is there salvation in any other. For there is no other name under heaven given to men, whereby we must be saved.
God’s Love is so powerful that He can heal broken souls – we think of our own failings and know that Jesus Christ is calling for us to be healed.
1 Jn 3:1-2 See what Love the Father has bestowed on us, that we may be called the children of God the reason that the world does not know us is because the world did not know Him …
1 Behold what manner of charity the Father hath bestowed upon us, that we should be called, and should be the sons of God. Therefore the world knoweth not us, because it knew not him. 2 Dearly beloved, we are now the sons of God; and it hath not yet appeared what we shall be. We know, that, when he shall appear, we shall be like to him: because we shall see him as he is.
Christ enters into the place of brokenness and confusion and darkness. He opens up the next level of denial and garbage and allows us to feel so secure that we can open up the wound and go into the darkness and unlock those chambers while we are resting and remove the poison/garbage at each level – we allow Christ to take whatever is unhealthy and Christ removes the rot and does the doing. We stay in that zone until He goes in and tames the roots.
Christ wants us forever to be little beginners; the measure between God and us is INFINITE.
All these people are having the exactly the same kinds of experiences. We are His Beloved. The word “Beloved” in itself is so beautiful.
Romans 9:1-3 “There is no monkey crazier than St Paul.” (Yup. That is a direct quote from Fr Paul G)
St Paul goes really insane. I’m dead on. – I speak the Truth in Christ. My … I have great sorrow and constant anguish. Separated from my brothers. Christ cannot Live without coming alive in the one next to you !
1 I speak the truth in Christ, I lie not, my conscience bearing me witness in the Holy Ghost: 2 That I have great sadness, and continual sorrow in my heart. 3 For I wished myself to be an anathema from Christ, for my brethren, who are my kinsmen according to the flesh,
Jn 10: 11-18
11 I am the good shepherd. The good shepherd gives his life for his sheep. 12 But the hireling, and he that is not the shepherd, whose own the sheep are not, sees the wolf coming, and leaves the sheep, and flees: and the wolf catches, and scatters the sheep: 13 And the hireling flees, because he is a hireling: and he hath no care for the sheep. 14 I am the good shepherd; and I know mine, and mine know me. 15 As the Father knows me, and I know the Father: and I lay down my life for my sheep.
16 And other sheep I have, that are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice, and there shall be one fold and one shepherd. 17 Therefore doth the Father love me: because I lay down my life, that I may take it again. 18 No man takes it away from me: but I lay it down of myself, and I have power to lay it down: and I have power to take it up again. This commandment have I received of my Father.
I Am the Good Shepherd … I lay down My Life for My sheep. St Paul got this “crazy” Love from Jesus Who got it from the Father so we have a crazy family… The hireling sees the wolf coming and runs away… because He works for pay. I know Mine and Mine know Me. Jesus knows how Beloved He is of the Father. The two of them are coming into intimate union, communion over and over. You are just as Beloved to me as I Am beloved by My Heavenly Father and I want you to become just as beloved of Me. He who works for pay and has no concern for the sheep. Just as I know the Father and the Father knows Me. I will lay down My Life for the sheep. Other sheep I have that are not of This Fold. This is why the Father Loves Me. I have power to lay My Life down and the power to take it up again. This command I have received from My Father.
St Paul: I need my brothers, sisters [others] to come into this union with me or I will never be who I am !
Our greatest gift to Christ is what we will allow Him to do for us.
All we can do is receive. Be open to receive more. Anything else is an insult. I get so thrilled with that. Open yourself to receive more. Be a place to receive.
Only God Himself has the power to lay down His Life. You can’t, you don’t have the power to empty yourself. Christ Himself infuses His power – that He alone has – to lay down our life – let it be My power – My activity combined with your willingness to let this [contemplative] stuff go on – than lay down your life. We don’t have to worry about the fact that I can’t be a good person, can’t pray, can’t do anything much. “I live now, not I, but Christ in me.” (Galatians 2:20)
Humility – I really can’t do it. Guess what. You have a little bit more humility now, so allow Me to enter in. An ongoing resignation, spirit of resignation to My Presence, My Divinity – Poverty of Spirit – an on-going resignation to let Christ work. Allowing God’s Holy Spirit to wed our spirit – two becoming one, Allowing the Holy Spirit to overshadow us.
All prayer is Christ’s own prayer so that our capacity to move in Divine ways and our inner being moves and consecrates – time to open the secret passages.
Just the physical Presence of God Himself is not enough – He needs us to allow an access so that the relationship is mutual. He then frees more of us to participate. Christ wants us to become integrated. Christ wants us to be vulnerable, exposed (not compartmentalized) to Him. He receives from within us His own self. We are activated by His grace and we participate.
Christ could not become Man unless there was a Gift – a Supernatural Grace given by Christ on the Cross – an advance on the allowance – the Blessed Virgin Mary could not have done Her work as the Mother of God only as a creature (by or according to human nature) – she needed a unique Divine (Supernatural/Sanctifying) Grace. She is full of grace: She is The Immaculate Conception.
Monday, April 13, 2009
Something Strange Is Happening ...
Discipleship Meeting
April 13, 2009
Something strange is happening….
We shared movie reviews and Triduum experiences. The following movies were recommended:
St. Rita, Mother Teresa, Song of Bernadette, St. Patrick of Ireland
Father Paul shared that when he came back to the Church, he joined a friend who had a study group. One of the people was on the Board of Trustees at a school. This person was going to meet with Spirit Guides. Father Paul said he stayed in prayer, in union with Christ. He said they were doing whatever…they normally go into some kind of whatever they do, and the people trying to call on the spirit guides said they were having a hard time dialing in on what they normally do. Their spirit guides were saying there was a much higher power in the room, and they did not want to come out with a much higher power in the room. Jesus was in the room! Father Paul said he did not say a word. They recognized a power greater than they had going on. Moses came with the power of the Lord. Spirits may or may not be lined up with God. There are holy angels and rebellious ones that are “fallen” aka demons. These realms are very real
Beth
There is a Catholic book about Saints who brought people back from the dead.
Father Paul
We don’t want to say that miracles only “used to happen.” We don’t want to limit God to what has been done. We don’t know what God is about to do.
Chris
I am interested in Pope John Paul II. Being a history teacher, I reminisced about the politics and the political-science piece. He had such an impact around the world. It was just the anniversary of his death. We talked about him in class. He was the most-traveled Pope and created World Youth Day. He is impacting the world today through students.
Sister Sheila
In 2004, I went to Rome and they were celebrating his 25th year. [At the time] I was working with victims of sexual abuse. I got a ticket to go to the public audience. You show your ticket and go to next place. The seat was right behind all the Cardinals and Bishops. What was moving was [the Pope] was suffering so much and here he was reaching out to all the people who had come to see him.
Chris
There is a lot I learned about his life…growing up Poland…the Nazi’s …he was at such a young age. He asked the Cardinal [why he had been chosen as Pope and the Cardinal said] everyone else said, “No” to him. He suffered and gave Mass from his hospital bed. He forgave the man who shot at him. He is inspiring.
We read from Liturgy of the Hours,” From an ancient homily on Holy Saturday” ( p.496)
The Lord descends into hell
“Something strange is happening—there is a great silence on earth today, a great silence and stillness. The whole earth keeps silence because the King is asleep. The earth trembled and is still because God has fallen asleep in the flesh and he has raised up all who have slept ever since the world began. God has died in the flesh and hell trembles with fear.
He has gone to search for our first parent, as for a lost sheep. Greatly desiring to visit those who live in darkness and in the shadow of death, he has gone to free from sorrow the captives Adam and Eve, he who is both God and the son of Eve. The Lord approached them bearing the cross, the weapon that had won him the victory. At the sight of him Adam, the first man he had created, struck his breast in terror and cried out to everyone: ‘My Lord be with you all.’ Christ answered him: ‘And with your spirit.’ He took him by the hand and raised him up, saying: ‘Awake, O sleeper, and rise from the dead, and Christ will give you light.’
I am your God, who for your sake have become your son. Out of love for you and for your descendants I now by my own authority command all who are held in bondage to come forth, all who are in darkness to be enlightened, all who are sleeping to arise. I order you, O sleeper, to awake. I did not create you to be held a prisoner in hell. Rise from the dead, for I am the life of the dead. Rise up, work of my hands, you who were created in my image. Rise, let us leave this place, for you are in me and I am in you; together we form only one person and we cannot be separated.
For your sake I, your God, became your son; I, the Lord, took the form of a slave; I, whose home is above the heavens, descended to the earth and beneath the earth. For your sake, for the sake of man, I became like a man without help, free among the dead. For the sake of you, who left a garden, I was betrayed to the Jews in a garden, and I was crucified in a garden.
See on my face the spittle I received in order to restore to you the life I once breathed into you. See there the marks of the blows I received in order to refashion your warped nature in my image. On my back see the marks of the scourging I endured to remove the burden of sin that weighs upon your back. See my hands, nailed firmly to a tree, for you who once wickedly stretched out your hand to a tree.
I slept on the cross and a sword pierced my side for you who slept in paradise and brought forth Eve from your side. My side has healed the pain in yours. My sleep will rouse you from your sleep in hell. The sword that pierced me has sheathed the sword that was turned against you.
Rise, let us leave this place. The enemy led you out of the earthly paradise. I will not restore you to that paradise, but I will enthrone you in heaven. I forbade you the tree that was only a symbol of life, but see, I who am life itself am now one with you. I appointed cherubim to guard you as slaves are guarded, but now I make them worship you as God. The throne formed by cherubim awaits you, its bearers swift and eager. The bridal chamber is adorned, the banquet is ready, the eternal dwelling places are prepared, the treasure houses of all good things lie open. The kingdom of heaven has been prepared for you from all eternity.”
Chris
“Something strange is happening—there is a great silence on earth today, a great silence and stillness. The whole earth keeps silence because the King is asleep.”
Father Paul
Do you have an impression of that Beth?
Mando
Is this when Jesus rises?
Father Paul
No. He is dead. When he dies…he goes down!
This writer is going to tell you why he is suggesting this strange thing between when He dies…and when he rises…Holy Saturday. Don’t miss this gap. It’s not just Good Friday and Easter Sunday. He is going into some corners and places people don’t normally go.
Beth
“The earth trembled and is still because God has fallen asleep in the flesh…”
Father Paul
God cannot die. Jesus in his humanity can die. God cannot die!
Beth
“…and he has raised up all who have slept ever since the world began.”
Father Paul
God has raised up all who have ever fallen asleep since the world ever began.
Beth
God has died in the flesh and hell trembles with fear.
Father Paul
This is a very strange thing going on. Does hell know what’s going on? Only God can conceive what He has done in Jesus Christ. Now the ones who have fallen asleep are waking up. Christ is going to search for our first parents. He is waking all the others
Beth
“He has gone to search for our first parent, as for a lost sheep.”
Father Paul
Is this cute or what? The Good Shepherd is going way out of His way to get the original lost sheep.
Beth
“Greatly desiring to visit those who live in darkness and in the shadow of death, he has gone to free from sorrow the captives Adam and Eve, he who is both God and the son of Eve.”
Father Paul
Can you imagine His Passion continuing? His Passion was not done. He went to look for His first parents. He approaches them carrying the cross…bearing their sins…to show them what He did for them…to hang their sins on the cross. He became sin for us…to hang their sin on the cross.
Bethany
He is showing them their salvation and how they are going to leave this place.
Father Paul
Can they get out of there any other way?
John
Now He becomes the tree of life.
Father Paul
They became happy campers. It was a very warm campfire!
Hell trembles with fear—it doesn’t say why---wait, we have an unexpected guest…we didn’t invite this one down here. No body is an expert on hell. We do know there is a place where people choose to stay apart from God, one way or another. We are getting Christ’s approach for whatever the devil has cooked up.
Kristal
Whatever…this chamber or that chamber…balcony or ringside…whatever…this guest was marching to His original mom and dad.
Bethany
St. Luke said he had to bind the strong man. This was the devils’ kingdom. He has bound the strong man. He [Christ] was invading their kingdom and taking it back.
Father Paul
Christ is going into the home turf of demons. He goes further and further into their kingdom. Now he is taking His cross and saying, “I am not done yet! I am going for seconds! What is for desert?” He has a one track heart.
Chris
Before Christ, was there heaven?
Father Paul
There was a possibility…maybe those who were faithful in another chamber. What we do get is Jesus says…”Let’s take it back to the original mom and dad.”
Mando
Hell is trembling with fear.
Father Paul
Jesus says, hold on Bub!
Bethany
The devil inspired all that hatred, and then he killed Christ and thought he got rid of Him.
Mando
A professor asked his students if they would tell others about Christ. Many said they would not. The professor asked if a gun was pointed to their heads, would they say that Christ was their savior? Many said, “No!”
Father Paul
Do we believe in God? God believes in us. He believed in our goodness. He believed in us. He did not die for an idea. He died because He believed in us. He would not give up on that belief.
Beth
When Adam and Eve sinned, he killed the animal to cover them. Even though they sinned, His mercy is a promise that they will be redeemed.
Father Paul
Christ shed his blood in anticipation.
Beth
After they sinned, they were truly repentant.
Scottie
“The Lord approached them bearing the cross, the weapon that had won him the victory. At the sight of him Adam, the first man he had created, struck his breast in terror and cried out to everyone: ‘My Lord be with you all.’”
Father Paul
Adam, the original cries out, “The Lord be with you all!” He is encouraging everyone else. He is moved passionately conveying to his children, “The Lord be with you all!” It sounds like Adam is functioning as a priest.
Nicholas
And “Christ answered him: ‘And with your spirit.’” Before we get to that, Christ makes all of us priests….chewing on that…and with your spirit could mean a few things. Was it a response, or in addition to?
Father Paul
Hold on…here we go! We don’t know who the ancient writer is. We don’t have details, but we are free to move with it. Christ comes up to Adam and Christ is speaking to Adam on behalf of the whole family. Jesus is coming back to give it to Adam. Adam takes responsibility as father and priest. Receive what has been given to you from the Lord.
Adam says, “The Lord be with you.” His human person understands, “The Lord be with you.” as much as I know who you are. Christ knows more about who they are, their spirit. He is awakening in them a deeper capacity to come in union with God. Christ is saying something deeper with “Spirit”. Heck with saving you back the way you were…you are going to be part of divinity! We aren’t just going to clean up, we are going to bring you in union with Christ.
Joe
“He took him by the hand…”
Father Paul
Taking his dad by the hand…his dad who screwed up…we have gotten to go back to our parents and share graces Christ has given us…we help them heal.
Joe
“He took him by the hand and raised him up, saying: ‘Awake, O sleeper, and rise from the dead, and Christ will give you light.’”
Nicholas
Is it meaningful that they call them “sleepers?”
Father Paul
In the Gospels, Christ would say, “They are sleeping.” They made fun of him saying a woman was sleeping who was really dead. Even Lazarus started to stink…[again, Christ says] he was “sleeping.”
Joe
“I am your God, who for your sake have become your son.”
John
Adam is humbled. One of his own has come to save him.
Father Paul
Also, one by one, more are coming into chambers. Adam is saying, “Oh, not another one…now here comes this guy carrying this cross…who is this one?”
Efrian
When they are in this hell, when Christ came they were all in this sleep. They must have looked to their dad.
He was the only one who knew him from Creation & Jesus knew that. He said this to them. He is with you. I am introducing him to you. That was the feeling I got. He is the one who had that relationship. If someone hurt your father, the kids avenge them. This child gave my life for you so that you too can enter into the graces.
Debbie & Krystal
“Out of love for you and for your descendants I now by my own authority command all who are held in bondage to come forth, all who are in darkness to be enlightened, all who are sleeping to arise. I order you, O sleeper, to awake. I did not create you to be held a prisoner in hell. Rise from the dead, for I am the life of the dead. Rise up, work of my hands, you who were created in my image. Rise, let us leave this place, for you are in me and I am in you; together we form only one person and we cannot be separated.“
Father Paul
He is doing this for all of us. He does it out of his own authority. The buck stops here…I am the buck!
No more foolin’ around. They are in hell…in darkness…sleeping. That is the one I like…sleeping.
Bob
At this point, he is emptying hell.
Efrian
Because love is how He did it. The other Ten Commandments were set by the Father. The last one was from Him; He went to hell for us.
Laura
“I did not create you to be held a prisoner in hell. Rise from the dead, for I am the life of the dead. Rise up, work of my hands…”
Father Paul
I am the original God from the old days. Down there they probably had a pretty good memory. Jesus is doing this by His own authority.
Laura
“Rise from the dead, for I am the life of the dead. Rise up, work of my hands, you who were created in my image. Rise, let us leave this place, for you are in me and I am in you.”
Kristal & Father Paul
Jesus is in Adam because He is a descendant in Adam
Sister Sheila
Jesus has given His life for us.
Father Paul
He gave His life in our place.
Laura
“Rise, let us leave this place, for you are in me and I am in you; together we form only one person and we cannot be separated.”
Father Paul
Jesus says let us leave this place together…for you are in me and I am in you.
Sounds like this is Jesus’ opinion huh? Does it sound like Jesus is going to change his opinion soon? I don’t hear him saying it is His theory. I don’t hear Him saying, “Let’s try this out as a possibility….He is not telling a story asking for subscribers.”
Sister Sheila
This is very intimate and powerful; very intimate for God to be saying this to us.
Bethany
Your maker will be your husband. We are one person; we cannot separate that. Our destiny is that mystical marriage with God. I don’t think we can put our finger on it. They are entering into the mystical marriage with God.
Laura
Together we form one person. “Rise from the dead, for I am the life of the dead. Rise up, work of my hands, you who were created in my image. Rise, let us leave this place, for you are in me and I am in you; together we form only one person and we cannot be separated.”
Father Paul
[Jesus] sounds like kind of a mad lover!
Efrian
I think it is the One Body. They are genetically the same DNA. We are One Body…One Church...this nuptial union.
Father Paul
This intimate oneness is our destiny. This is getting very real about it. [Christ said] I did not create you to be slaves. Work of my hands, you are not created for this. We are only one person. I cannot leave without you. You cannot stay without me here. There is only one here. My divine spirit is your divine spirit. This is our destiny together. I really want you to be open to this.
John D.
We become united in the light as one with Him in love and communion with Him.
Beth
Jesus is the same today, yesterday and tomorrow. I think He is doing that for us all the time. Are there others who turned away from him?
Father Paul
Why don’t we stay with the reading for now. We will come back. Let’s stay in the fullness of this, because it is the same of what Jesus is doing or calling us to do now. His longing is that our wills move with him. Let’s read what Jesus is longing to have with us.
Alex
“Out of love for you and for your descendants I now by my own authority command all who are held in bondage to come forth, all who are in darkness to be enlightened, all who are sleeping to arise. I order you, O sleeper, to awake. I did not create you to be held a prisoner in hell.”
Father Paul
Anybody get a feel of this? Christ says He didn’t create us for the little La La Land we are in.
Anyone get a feel of those little places in hell within us, or the places we are asleep? Is He over the top? Is He invading?
Sister Sheila
He has just emptied Himself with love. There is nothing left of Him. Together we form one person; we cannot be separated.
Father Paul
You’re right. I almost forgot where we came from. He’s not saying, ’Come on, we are going back to the cave.” He had done this out of love. He is coming to give divine freedom, divine union to persons who do not know how to be so free. This one who has just emptied Himself says, ‘You don’t need to know how to do this, I can do it if you lighten up and allow it. If you do, I can show you how.’
Bethany
This is big to me!
Father Paul
This is big to Christ! This is whole message of salvation. This is the whole point…for us to become in union with Christ and for him to come in union with us. This is the whole point.
Beth
I think that is why people are addicted to this kind of love. They are looking for the love.
Father Paul
That is right. The threshold of addiction has this power around it, but it doesn’t go that deep.
This is our destiny, our deepest hardware. St Augustine says this is what we are meant for. He says that our hearts are restless until they rest in Him. The Sacraments are the encounter, that divine encounter, of that reality.
Ron
The Holy Spirit comes down on you in baptism. You become one with the Holy Spirit. Christ is completing it there. The whole will is that Jesus comes down.
Father Paul
In the full conformity as to the ways of God, baptism doesn’t complete it Christian development. That was worked out by His obedience. His Human nature had to line up with divine nature. We are to line up with grace from baptism. This is the on-going work of God working us into the divine nuptial union with him. We participate.
Alex
“Out of love for you and for your descendants I now by my own authority command all who are held in bondage to come forth, all who are in darkness to be enlightened, all who are sleeping to arise. I order you, O sleeper, to awake. I did not create you to be held a prisoner in hell. Rise from the dead, for I am the life of the dead. Rise up, work of my hands, you who were created in my image. Rise, let us leave this place, for you are in me and I am in you; together we form only one person and we cannot be separated.” He tells them rise three times. He is persistent in His love. He knows their hearts. [They say] “What do you mean rise? We are dead!” He knows they keep wondering how are we going to do this. I sense He is responding to what they are saying.
Father Paul
This reminds me of the blind person when Jesus made spittle and mud. The healing took place in stages. We do have resistances, but we get part of it. Jesus understands our human nature and what it takes to move us.
Alex
“For your sake I, your God, became your son; I, the Lord, took the form of a slave; I, whose home is above the heavens, descended to the earth and beneath the earth. For your sake, for the sake of man, I became like a man without help, free among the dead.”
Sister Sheila
You might say you feel so much pain, so desperate…without help.
Laura
I take it as Him speaking what His purpose was. For our sake He was created as man. He is reaffirming to them that He is there for our sake…like a man without help…He is giving us the message of what He is here for.
Josephine
When all is lost, [he is] “a man without help.” Only in God when there is no one else are you going to find help in God. Only when you have lost your right to life, only God can help you.
Father Paul
Is it okay during the day to feel like a person without help? On the cross Jesus felt like He was abandoned. I cannot help that all through the day I am a person without any help. I feel like I can’t help people. I believe that this is an incredibly awesome measure of being like Mother Teresa who felt abandoned, like Christ in that place. By grace of a mystical community, I do not have to flee where Padre Pio stayed in that place for a long time. He was willing to stay in that place of darkness.
Robert
In our existential aloneness there is no way we can get help. Mary and Mary Magdalene would like to have helped.
Father Paul
Me continuing to stay in that place and feeling as if there is no hope…it is not a bad place.
Robert
God does it to toughen us.
Father Paul
God let’s us know He is speaking deeper. Don’t be tricked by feelings. With a lot of grace on the inside I don’t have to run to other things or other feelings. I used to try other measures. I can be in union with the greater body of the church. It takes so much grace to sustain a little bit of this action. Padre Pio would feel very angry but his guardian angel would help him to trust in Christ.
Chris
“For the sake of you, who left a garden, I was betrayed to the Jews in a garden, and I was crucified in a garden.
See on my face the spittle I received in order to restore to you the life I once breathed into you. See there the marks of the blows I received in order to refashion your warped nature in my image.”
Father Paul
He is coming with the spit on His face. He is not the Resurrected Jesus. He is coming as He was on the cross…bloody and beaten. He is not cleaned up. Makes more sense this guy showing up as he was on the cross…Adam wasn’t being dramatic…this makes much more sense.
Chris
“On my back see the marks of the scourging I endured to remove the burden of sin that weighs upon your back. See my hands, nailed firmly to a tree, for you who once wickedly stretched out your hand to a tree.”
Father Paul
Someone else [Adam and Eve] reached for the tree to get a glorious experience.
Chris
“I slept on the cross and a sword pierced my side for you who slept in paradise and brought forth Eve from your side. My side has healed the pain in yours. My sleep will rouse you from your sleep in hell. The sword that pierced me has sheathed the sword that was turned against you.”
Father Paul
What is the wound in my side? Is it my fear or when I am arrogant?
Bethany
If He is talking to Adam specifically, [Adam was to] guard the garden from something on the outside. Adam was responsible to look after his bride, Eve. Perhaps it was this heartache where “your bride fell” and Christ’s bride has been sanctified. The two verbs guard and till the garden is like the priests who were to guard the covenant. God’s command to Adam is not just [to] till and make beautiful, but guard it from the enemy. When Eve was at the tree, she had to go find Adam. Adam wasn’t doing his job. Ephesians says the Church is the Bride of Christ and sanctified by Christ. Eve came out of both sides. Adam’s bride fell from grace. Adam was wondering, What did I start? Adam wasn’t guarding the garden, and Eve was the heartache in his side. She came from his side and fell. Christ’s bride came from His side and has been sanctified.
Father Paul
For me, I want to fulfill a woman’s life, to authentically making their life right. You think you will make the family right. But in this context, who can do it? Jesus says, there isn’t that right mother, father ,child…
Rosemarie
That pain of Adam is his disobedience and compromising with going with flow of Eve. Christ went with the Father’s will to death. Generations are coming back. [Adam’s pain is] that pain of seeing them all come.
Someone recommended reading books by Scott Hahn, in particular, A Father Who Keeps His Promises . Also, the website CatholiCity.com was given as a resource for Catholic cd’s and novels.
Beth
Why can’t God get us another way? It does kind of go back to the original, to the source, the cause of the problem. It does make more sense. God is showing us the source of why he had to save us like this.
Matthew
“I slept on the cross and a sword pierced my side for you who slept in paradise and brought forth Eve from your side. My side has healed the pain in yours. My sleep will rouse you from your sleep in hell. The sword that pierced me has sheathed the sword that was turned against you.
Rise, let us leave this place. The enemy led you out of the earthly paradise. I will not restore you to that paradise, but I will enthrone you in heaven. I forbade you the tree that was only a symbol of life, but see, I who am life itself am now one with you. I appointed cherubim to guard you as slaves are guarded, but now I make them worship you as God.”
Father Paul
Ok. Somebody threw a brick through a window! How did he [the author] describe it in the beginning? Strange. This is definitely strange….would you mind reading that again? This is extreme. We want to go back to the garden. This is extreme!
Matthew re-read.
“My side has healed the pain in yours. My sleep will rouse you from your sleep in hell. The sword that pierced me has sheathed the sword that was turned against you.
Rise, let us leave this place. The enemy led you out of the earthly paradise. I will not restore you to that paradise, but I will enthrone you in heaven. I forbade you the tree that was only a symbol of life, but see, I who am life itself am now one with you. I appointed cherubim to guard you as slaves are guarded, but now I make them worship you as God.”
Father Paul
Who is going to worship you? The angels are going to be worshiping you as God! I am not just going to have you go to heaven, but worship you. Jesus is saying, “Get used to how awesome you are.” Would you be comfortable having cherubim worshiping you? If you are humble, you will take this. Humility is truth. This is who we are as One.
John
You feel like you are not worthy.
Father Paul
This is ancient Catholic teaching, hard-core Catholic. You can see why people would skip over this “strange” story.
Rosemarie
Pilot says to Him, “You are a king.” [Jesus says that ] the reason I came was to testify to the truth, to tell us this truth; to tell us who we are. The devil gets us believing this and we keep buying his tricks. He came to tell the truth that you and I are One. One person.
Father Paul
Jesus says we are one. In my nervous system lies this fabric. I don’t want to be loved that much. I am not worthy. I don’t want the truth of who I am in Christ. I would say put me back in hell. I don’t want to be healed. I would rather burn in hell because of lies I have been told than to be in heaven worshiped by cherubim. But Jesus wants us to participate in our full inheritance. This is why we and others go back to our “drugs,” of different sorts. Our wiring pulls us to return to the darkness. We have to get used to the glory of God. It is easier to take rejection than awesome pure love. We are here to remind each other of our truth. Something in us wants to recoil the story, to say it is not this way.
Nicholas
This makes me think of suffering. Jesus endured a suffering. You need to be careful-there is this suffering you don’t have to be involved in where you are separating yourself from God. You can be present with someone in their suffering. You are suffering and you want to suffer…you don’t want help…you don’t want to be weak. This is a huge step gong to therapy. If you refuse, then you don’t admit you need help. There is a balance you need. Don’t suffer just because you hate yourself. It leads to a suffering that is inevitable. There is a de-valuing of yourself that causes suffering.
Efrian
Church teaches suffering is redemptive it you join it to Christ. To suffer just because of pain, they do it just to suffer.
Father Paul
Anyone who has a longing for suffering is twisted and sick. Anyone who prayed for Padre Pio to live longer, he considered his enemies. We stay true to the love and not the suffering, per se- in itself.
Ethan
The second Sunday of Lent is The Transfiguration. As we get ready to go into Lent, we can see the glory of God so that we can see the fullness of His love. We don’t just go in to suffer.
Father Paul
All lies are snapping. They are popping. As we stay with Christ, they keep popping. Ancestors and families start to get re-created as we move into these ways of love. There is an assembly we cannot see as we move in this way of love. It is all connected.
Krystal
Mother Teresa says love starts with a smile. It starts to open you up. It changes who you are in that moment.
Bethany
I think I have known this for years that the greatest impact I can have on people is not preaching or setting a good example, but growing in intimacy in Jesus.
Father Paul
Ding! Ding! Ding! That is the whole concept right there!
Josephine
“I appointed cherubim to guard you as slaves are guarded, but now I make them worship you as God. The throne formed by cherubim awaits you, its bearers swift and eager. The bridal chamber is adorned, the banquet is ready, the eternal dwelling places are prepared, the treasure houses of all good things lie open. The kingdom of heaven has been prepared for you from all eternity.”
Beth
That is what I heard that when we receive communion the angels adore us because we have received Him.
Father Paul
Jesus takes it real deep. The angels are adoring Y O U. We always want to deflect that they are adoring Him. He says, “No, they are adoring you!”
Bethany
Aren’t we worshiped because we are divinized in Him?
Father Paul
Yes, it is His divinity. They are worshiping Christ. He has become One with His bride. Don’t keep moving it back to Christ. Get back to full focus. If you don’t, the devil will steal your inheritance! Take your inheritance. Don’t take part [of it or] you will be enslaved again. Take the whole thing. What will they trick you with…some belonging…some affirmation…what can he trick you with? There is nothing else [if you take your full inheritance!]
Beth
Is part of the torment [of hell that] you realize what you have lost or what you could have had?
Father Paul
There are parts in me that I don’t really believe what Christ is doing in me. I am in my own little hell. So, we don’t want to speculate what others are experiencing in hell. I know when others are living in this kind of love, it affects people here and there. So, I think like Bethany said, the best way to experience it is to experience that love. St. Therese, The Little Flower stopped being a hero. She let Christ start living in her and in love with her. She was forgetting about other souls and experiencing this nuptial agreement directly. For me, it is much easier to go off and do something for the Lord than to encounter this intimacy and let is set me free and express itself. [ I have to be willing to] feel helpless and let this intimacy go through me and be ok with this feeling. What makes me “feel” better is to go back to the dungeon. [That is easier than to] stay in direct action and true intimacy. It makes me feel like I need to grab someone and go get tangled up again. Then I act like a brat to tangle myself again. You can be free to stay in love virtuously, morally, and simply in the kingdom of God. It doesn’t necessarily look like anything very interesting is happening.
Closing prayer.
Peace be with you! Please join us for the next meeting.
April 13, 2009
Something strange is happening….
We shared movie reviews and Triduum experiences. The following movies were recommended:
St. Rita, Mother Teresa, Song of Bernadette, St. Patrick of Ireland
Father Paul shared that when he came back to the Church, he joined a friend who had a study group. One of the people was on the Board of Trustees at a school. This person was going to meet with Spirit Guides. Father Paul said he stayed in prayer, in union with Christ. He said they were doing whatever…they normally go into some kind of whatever they do, and the people trying to call on the spirit guides said they were having a hard time dialing in on what they normally do. Their spirit guides were saying there was a much higher power in the room, and they did not want to come out with a much higher power in the room. Jesus was in the room! Father Paul said he did not say a word. They recognized a power greater than they had going on. Moses came with the power of the Lord. Spirits may or may not be lined up with God. There are holy angels and rebellious ones that are “fallen” aka demons. These realms are very real
Beth
There is a Catholic book about Saints who brought people back from the dead.
Father Paul
We don’t want to say that miracles only “used to happen.” We don’t want to limit God to what has been done. We don’t know what God is about to do.
Chris
I am interested in Pope John Paul II. Being a history teacher, I reminisced about the politics and the political-science piece. He had such an impact around the world. It was just the anniversary of his death. We talked about him in class. He was the most-traveled Pope and created World Youth Day. He is impacting the world today through students.
Sister Sheila
In 2004, I went to Rome and they were celebrating his 25th year. [At the time] I was working with victims of sexual abuse. I got a ticket to go to the public audience. You show your ticket and go to next place. The seat was right behind all the Cardinals and Bishops. What was moving was [the Pope] was suffering so much and here he was reaching out to all the people who had come to see him.
Chris
There is a lot I learned about his life…growing up Poland…the Nazi’s …he was at such a young age. He asked the Cardinal [why he had been chosen as Pope and the Cardinal said] everyone else said, “No” to him. He suffered and gave Mass from his hospital bed. He forgave the man who shot at him. He is inspiring.
We read from Liturgy of the Hours,” From an ancient homily on Holy Saturday” ( p.496)
The Lord descends into hell
“Something strange is happening—there is a great silence on earth today, a great silence and stillness. The whole earth keeps silence because the King is asleep. The earth trembled and is still because God has fallen asleep in the flesh and he has raised up all who have slept ever since the world began. God has died in the flesh and hell trembles with fear.
He has gone to search for our first parent, as for a lost sheep. Greatly desiring to visit those who live in darkness and in the shadow of death, he has gone to free from sorrow the captives Adam and Eve, he who is both God and the son of Eve. The Lord approached them bearing the cross, the weapon that had won him the victory. At the sight of him Adam, the first man he had created, struck his breast in terror and cried out to everyone: ‘My Lord be with you all.’ Christ answered him: ‘And with your spirit.’ He took him by the hand and raised him up, saying: ‘Awake, O sleeper, and rise from the dead, and Christ will give you light.’
I am your God, who for your sake have become your son. Out of love for you and for your descendants I now by my own authority command all who are held in bondage to come forth, all who are in darkness to be enlightened, all who are sleeping to arise. I order you, O sleeper, to awake. I did not create you to be held a prisoner in hell. Rise from the dead, for I am the life of the dead. Rise up, work of my hands, you who were created in my image. Rise, let us leave this place, for you are in me and I am in you; together we form only one person and we cannot be separated.
For your sake I, your God, became your son; I, the Lord, took the form of a slave; I, whose home is above the heavens, descended to the earth and beneath the earth. For your sake, for the sake of man, I became like a man without help, free among the dead. For the sake of you, who left a garden, I was betrayed to the Jews in a garden, and I was crucified in a garden.
See on my face the spittle I received in order to restore to you the life I once breathed into you. See there the marks of the blows I received in order to refashion your warped nature in my image. On my back see the marks of the scourging I endured to remove the burden of sin that weighs upon your back. See my hands, nailed firmly to a tree, for you who once wickedly stretched out your hand to a tree.
I slept on the cross and a sword pierced my side for you who slept in paradise and brought forth Eve from your side. My side has healed the pain in yours. My sleep will rouse you from your sleep in hell. The sword that pierced me has sheathed the sword that was turned against you.
Rise, let us leave this place. The enemy led you out of the earthly paradise. I will not restore you to that paradise, but I will enthrone you in heaven. I forbade you the tree that was only a symbol of life, but see, I who am life itself am now one with you. I appointed cherubim to guard you as slaves are guarded, but now I make them worship you as God. The throne formed by cherubim awaits you, its bearers swift and eager. The bridal chamber is adorned, the banquet is ready, the eternal dwelling places are prepared, the treasure houses of all good things lie open. The kingdom of heaven has been prepared for you from all eternity.”
Chris
“Something strange is happening—there is a great silence on earth today, a great silence and stillness. The whole earth keeps silence because the King is asleep.”
Father Paul
Do you have an impression of that Beth?
Mando
Is this when Jesus rises?
Father Paul
No. He is dead. When he dies…he goes down!
This writer is going to tell you why he is suggesting this strange thing between when He dies…and when he rises…Holy Saturday. Don’t miss this gap. It’s not just Good Friday and Easter Sunday. He is going into some corners and places people don’t normally go.
Beth
“The earth trembled and is still because God has fallen asleep in the flesh…”
Father Paul
God cannot die. Jesus in his humanity can die. God cannot die!
Beth
“…and he has raised up all who have slept ever since the world began.”
Father Paul
God has raised up all who have ever fallen asleep since the world ever began.
Beth
God has died in the flesh and hell trembles with fear.
Father Paul
This is a very strange thing going on. Does hell know what’s going on? Only God can conceive what He has done in Jesus Christ. Now the ones who have fallen asleep are waking up. Christ is going to search for our first parents. He is waking all the others
Beth
“He has gone to search for our first parent, as for a lost sheep.”
Father Paul
Is this cute or what? The Good Shepherd is going way out of His way to get the original lost sheep.
Beth
“Greatly desiring to visit those who live in darkness and in the shadow of death, he has gone to free from sorrow the captives Adam and Eve, he who is both God and the son of Eve.”
Father Paul
Can you imagine His Passion continuing? His Passion was not done. He went to look for His first parents. He approaches them carrying the cross…bearing their sins…to show them what He did for them…to hang their sins on the cross. He became sin for us…to hang their sin on the cross.
Bethany
He is showing them their salvation and how they are going to leave this place.
Father Paul
Can they get out of there any other way?
John
Now He becomes the tree of life.
Father Paul
They became happy campers. It was a very warm campfire!
Hell trembles with fear—it doesn’t say why---wait, we have an unexpected guest…we didn’t invite this one down here. No body is an expert on hell. We do know there is a place where people choose to stay apart from God, one way or another. We are getting Christ’s approach for whatever the devil has cooked up.
Kristal
Whatever…this chamber or that chamber…balcony or ringside…whatever…this guest was marching to His original mom and dad.
Bethany
St. Luke said he had to bind the strong man. This was the devils’ kingdom. He has bound the strong man. He [Christ] was invading their kingdom and taking it back.
Father Paul
Christ is going into the home turf of demons. He goes further and further into their kingdom. Now he is taking His cross and saying, “I am not done yet! I am going for seconds! What is for desert?” He has a one track heart.
Chris
Before Christ, was there heaven?
Father Paul
There was a possibility…maybe those who were faithful in another chamber. What we do get is Jesus says…”Let’s take it back to the original mom and dad.”
Mando
Hell is trembling with fear.
Father Paul
Jesus says, hold on Bub!
Bethany
The devil inspired all that hatred, and then he killed Christ and thought he got rid of Him.
Mando
A professor asked his students if they would tell others about Christ. Many said they would not. The professor asked if a gun was pointed to their heads, would they say that Christ was their savior? Many said, “No!”
Father Paul
Do we believe in God? God believes in us. He believed in our goodness. He believed in us. He did not die for an idea. He died because He believed in us. He would not give up on that belief.
Beth
When Adam and Eve sinned, he killed the animal to cover them. Even though they sinned, His mercy is a promise that they will be redeemed.
Father Paul
Christ shed his blood in anticipation.
Beth
After they sinned, they were truly repentant.
Scottie
“The Lord approached them bearing the cross, the weapon that had won him the victory. At the sight of him Adam, the first man he had created, struck his breast in terror and cried out to everyone: ‘My Lord be with you all.’”
Father Paul
Adam, the original cries out, “The Lord be with you all!” He is encouraging everyone else. He is moved passionately conveying to his children, “The Lord be with you all!” It sounds like Adam is functioning as a priest.
Nicholas
And “Christ answered him: ‘And with your spirit.’” Before we get to that, Christ makes all of us priests….chewing on that…and with your spirit could mean a few things. Was it a response, or in addition to?
Father Paul
Hold on…here we go! We don’t know who the ancient writer is. We don’t have details, but we are free to move with it. Christ comes up to Adam and Christ is speaking to Adam on behalf of the whole family. Jesus is coming back to give it to Adam. Adam takes responsibility as father and priest. Receive what has been given to you from the Lord.
Adam says, “The Lord be with you.” His human person understands, “The Lord be with you.” as much as I know who you are. Christ knows more about who they are, their spirit. He is awakening in them a deeper capacity to come in union with God. Christ is saying something deeper with “Spirit”. Heck with saving you back the way you were…you are going to be part of divinity! We aren’t just going to clean up, we are going to bring you in union with Christ.
Joe
“He took him by the hand…”
Father Paul
Taking his dad by the hand…his dad who screwed up…we have gotten to go back to our parents and share graces Christ has given us…we help them heal.
Joe
“He took him by the hand and raised him up, saying: ‘Awake, O sleeper, and rise from the dead, and Christ will give you light.’”
Nicholas
Is it meaningful that they call them “sleepers?”
Father Paul
In the Gospels, Christ would say, “They are sleeping.” They made fun of him saying a woman was sleeping who was really dead. Even Lazarus started to stink…[again, Christ says] he was “sleeping.”
Joe
“I am your God, who for your sake have become your son.”
John
Adam is humbled. One of his own has come to save him.
Father Paul
Also, one by one, more are coming into chambers. Adam is saying, “Oh, not another one…now here comes this guy carrying this cross…who is this one?”
Efrian
When they are in this hell, when Christ came they were all in this sleep. They must have looked to their dad.
He was the only one who knew him from Creation & Jesus knew that. He said this to them. He is with you. I am introducing him to you. That was the feeling I got. He is the one who had that relationship. If someone hurt your father, the kids avenge them. This child gave my life for you so that you too can enter into the graces.
Debbie & Krystal
“Out of love for you and for your descendants I now by my own authority command all who are held in bondage to come forth, all who are in darkness to be enlightened, all who are sleeping to arise. I order you, O sleeper, to awake. I did not create you to be held a prisoner in hell. Rise from the dead, for I am the life of the dead. Rise up, work of my hands, you who were created in my image. Rise, let us leave this place, for you are in me and I am in you; together we form only one person and we cannot be separated.“
Father Paul
He is doing this for all of us. He does it out of his own authority. The buck stops here…I am the buck!
No more foolin’ around. They are in hell…in darkness…sleeping. That is the one I like…sleeping.
Bob
At this point, he is emptying hell.
Efrian
Because love is how He did it. The other Ten Commandments were set by the Father. The last one was from Him; He went to hell for us.
Laura
“I did not create you to be held a prisoner in hell. Rise from the dead, for I am the life of the dead. Rise up, work of my hands…”
Father Paul
I am the original God from the old days. Down there they probably had a pretty good memory. Jesus is doing this by His own authority.
Laura
“Rise from the dead, for I am the life of the dead. Rise up, work of my hands, you who were created in my image. Rise, let us leave this place, for you are in me and I am in you.”
Kristal & Father Paul
Jesus is in Adam because He is a descendant in Adam
Sister Sheila
Jesus has given His life for us.
Father Paul
He gave His life in our place.
Laura
“Rise, let us leave this place, for you are in me and I am in you; together we form only one person and we cannot be separated.”
Father Paul
Jesus says let us leave this place together…for you are in me and I am in you.
Sounds like this is Jesus’ opinion huh? Does it sound like Jesus is going to change his opinion soon? I don’t hear him saying it is His theory. I don’t hear Him saying, “Let’s try this out as a possibility….He is not telling a story asking for subscribers.”
Sister Sheila
This is very intimate and powerful; very intimate for God to be saying this to us.
Bethany
Your maker will be your husband. We are one person; we cannot separate that. Our destiny is that mystical marriage with God. I don’t think we can put our finger on it. They are entering into the mystical marriage with God.
Laura
Together we form one person. “Rise from the dead, for I am the life of the dead. Rise up, work of my hands, you who were created in my image. Rise, let us leave this place, for you are in me and I am in you; together we form only one person and we cannot be separated.”
Father Paul
[Jesus] sounds like kind of a mad lover!
Efrian
I think it is the One Body. They are genetically the same DNA. We are One Body…One Church...this nuptial union.
Father Paul
This intimate oneness is our destiny. This is getting very real about it. [Christ said] I did not create you to be slaves. Work of my hands, you are not created for this. We are only one person. I cannot leave without you. You cannot stay without me here. There is only one here. My divine spirit is your divine spirit. This is our destiny together. I really want you to be open to this.
John D.
We become united in the light as one with Him in love and communion with Him.
Beth
Jesus is the same today, yesterday and tomorrow. I think He is doing that for us all the time. Are there others who turned away from him?
Father Paul
Why don’t we stay with the reading for now. We will come back. Let’s stay in the fullness of this, because it is the same of what Jesus is doing or calling us to do now. His longing is that our wills move with him. Let’s read what Jesus is longing to have with us.
Alex
“Out of love for you and for your descendants I now by my own authority command all who are held in bondage to come forth, all who are in darkness to be enlightened, all who are sleeping to arise. I order you, O sleeper, to awake. I did not create you to be held a prisoner in hell.”
Father Paul
Anybody get a feel of this? Christ says He didn’t create us for the little La La Land we are in.
Anyone get a feel of those little places in hell within us, or the places we are asleep? Is He over the top? Is He invading?
Sister Sheila
He has just emptied Himself with love. There is nothing left of Him. Together we form one person; we cannot be separated.
Father Paul
You’re right. I almost forgot where we came from. He’s not saying, ’Come on, we are going back to the cave.” He had done this out of love. He is coming to give divine freedom, divine union to persons who do not know how to be so free. This one who has just emptied Himself says, ‘You don’t need to know how to do this, I can do it if you lighten up and allow it. If you do, I can show you how.’
Bethany
This is big to me!
Father Paul
This is big to Christ! This is whole message of salvation. This is the whole point…for us to become in union with Christ and for him to come in union with us. This is the whole point.
Beth
I think that is why people are addicted to this kind of love. They are looking for the love.
Father Paul
That is right. The threshold of addiction has this power around it, but it doesn’t go that deep.
This is our destiny, our deepest hardware. St Augustine says this is what we are meant for. He says that our hearts are restless until they rest in Him. The Sacraments are the encounter, that divine encounter, of that reality.
Ron
The Holy Spirit comes down on you in baptism. You become one with the Holy Spirit. Christ is completing it there. The whole will is that Jesus comes down.
Father Paul
In the full conformity as to the ways of God, baptism doesn’t complete it Christian development. That was worked out by His obedience. His Human nature had to line up with divine nature. We are to line up with grace from baptism. This is the on-going work of God working us into the divine nuptial union with him. We participate.
Alex
“Out of love for you and for your descendants I now by my own authority command all who are held in bondage to come forth, all who are in darkness to be enlightened, all who are sleeping to arise. I order you, O sleeper, to awake. I did not create you to be held a prisoner in hell. Rise from the dead, for I am the life of the dead. Rise up, work of my hands, you who were created in my image. Rise, let us leave this place, for you are in me and I am in you; together we form only one person and we cannot be separated.” He tells them rise three times. He is persistent in His love. He knows their hearts. [They say] “What do you mean rise? We are dead!” He knows they keep wondering how are we going to do this. I sense He is responding to what they are saying.
Father Paul
This reminds me of the blind person when Jesus made spittle and mud. The healing took place in stages. We do have resistances, but we get part of it. Jesus understands our human nature and what it takes to move us.
Alex
“For your sake I, your God, became your son; I, the Lord, took the form of a slave; I, whose home is above the heavens, descended to the earth and beneath the earth. For your sake, for the sake of man, I became like a man without help, free among the dead.”
Sister Sheila
You might say you feel so much pain, so desperate…without help.
Laura
I take it as Him speaking what His purpose was. For our sake He was created as man. He is reaffirming to them that He is there for our sake…like a man without help…He is giving us the message of what He is here for.
Josephine
When all is lost, [he is] “a man without help.” Only in God when there is no one else are you going to find help in God. Only when you have lost your right to life, only God can help you.
Father Paul
Is it okay during the day to feel like a person without help? On the cross Jesus felt like He was abandoned. I cannot help that all through the day I am a person without any help. I feel like I can’t help people. I believe that this is an incredibly awesome measure of being like Mother Teresa who felt abandoned, like Christ in that place. By grace of a mystical community, I do not have to flee where Padre Pio stayed in that place for a long time. He was willing to stay in that place of darkness.
Robert
In our existential aloneness there is no way we can get help. Mary and Mary Magdalene would like to have helped.
Father Paul
Me continuing to stay in that place and feeling as if there is no hope…it is not a bad place.
Robert
God does it to toughen us.
Father Paul
God let’s us know He is speaking deeper. Don’t be tricked by feelings. With a lot of grace on the inside I don’t have to run to other things or other feelings. I used to try other measures. I can be in union with the greater body of the church. It takes so much grace to sustain a little bit of this action. Padre Pio would feel very angry but his guardian angel would help him to trust in Christ.
Chris
“For the sake of you, who left a garden, I was betrayed to the Jews in a garden, and I was crucified in a garden.
See on my face the spittle I received in order to restore to you the life I once breathed into you. See there the marks of the blows I received in order to refashion your warped nature in my image.”
Father Paul
He is coming with the spit on His face. He is not the Resurrected Jesus. He is coming as He was on the cross…bloody and beaten. He is not cleaned up. Makes more sense this guy showing up as he was on the cross…Adam wasn’t being dramatic…this makes much more sense.
Chris
“On my back see the marks of the scourging I endured to remove the burden of sin that weighs upon your back. See my hands, nailed firmly to a tree, for you who once wickedly stretched out your hand to a tree.”
Father Paul
Someone else [Adam and Eve] reached for the tree to get a glorious experience.
Chris
“I slept on the cross and a sword pierced my side for you who slept in paradise and brought forth Eve from your side. My side has healed the pain in yours. My sleep will rouse you from your sleep in hell. The sword that pierced me has sheathed the sword that was turned against you.”
Father Paul
What is the wound in my side? Is it my fear or when I am arrogant?
Bethany
If He is talking to Adam specifically, [Adam was to] guard the garden from something on the outside. Adam was responsible to look after his bride, Eve. Perhaps it was this heartache where “your bride fell” and Christ’s bride has been sanctified. The two verbs guard and till the garden is like the priests who were to guard the covenant. God’s command to Adam is not just [to] till and make beautiful, but guard it from the enemy. When Eve was at the tree, she had to go find Adam. Adam wasn’t doing his job. Ephesians says the Church is the Bride of Christ and sanctified by Christ. Eve came out of both sides. Adam’s bride fell from grace. Adam was wondering, What did I start? Adam wasn’t guarding the garden, and Eve was the heartache in his side. She came from his side and fell. Christ’s bride came from His side and has been sanctified.
Father Paul
For me, I want to fulfill a woman’s life, to authentically making their life right. You think you will make the family right. But in this context, who can do it? Jesus says, there isn’t that right mother, father ,child…
Rosemarie
That pain of Adam is his disobedience and compromising with going with flow of Eve. Christ went with the Father’s will to death. Generations are coming back. [Adam’s pain is] that pain of seeing them all come.
Someone recommended reading books by Scott Hahn, in particular, A Father Who Keeps His Promises . Also, the website CatholiCity.com was given as a resource for Catholic cd’s and novels.
Beth
Why can’t God get us another way? It does kind of go back to the original, to the source, the cause of the problem. It does make more sense. God is showing us the source of why he had to save us like this.
Matthew
“I slept on the cross and a sword pierced my side for you who slept in paradise and brought forth Eve from your side. My side has healed the pain in yours. My sleep will rouse you from your sleep in hell. The sword that pierced me has sheathed the sword that was turned against you.
Rise, let us leave this place. The enemy led you out of the earthly paradise. I will not restore you to that paradise, but I will enthrone you in heaven. I forbade you the tree that was only a symbol of life, but see, I who am life itself am now one with you. I appointed cherubim to guard you as slaves are guarded, but now I make them worship you as God.”
Father Paul
Ok. Somebody threw a brick through a window! How did he [the author] describe it in the beginning? Strange. This is definitely strange….would you mind reading that again? This is extreme. We want to go back to the garden. This is extreme!
Matthew re-read.
“My side has healed the pain in yours. My sleep will rouse you from your sleep in hell. The sword that pierced me has sheathed the sword that was turned against you.
Rise, let us leave this place. The enemy led you out of the earthly paradise. I will not restore you to that paradise, but I will enthrone you in heaven. I forbade you the tree that was only a symbol of life, but see, I who am life itself am now one with you. I appointed cherubim to guard you as slaves are guarded, but now I make them worship you as God.”
Father Paul
Who is going to worship you? The angels are going to be worshiping you as God! I am not just going to have you go to heaven, but worship you. Jesus is saying, “Get used to how awesome you are.” Would you be comfortable having cherubim worshiping you? If you are humble, you will take this. Humility is truth. This is who we are as One.
John
You feel like you are not worthy.
Father Paul
This is ancient Catholic teaching, hard-core Catholic. You can see why people would skip over this “strange” story.
Rosemarie
Pilot says to Him, “You are a king.” [Jesus says that ] the reason I came was to testify to the truth, to tell us this truth; to tell us who we are. The devil gets us believing this and we keep buying his tricks. He came to tell the truth that you and I are One. One person.
Father Paul
Jesus says we are one. In my nervous system lies this fabric. I don’t want to be loved that much. I am not worthy. I don’t want the truth of who I am in Christ. I would say put me back in hell. I don’t want to be healed. I would rather burn in hell because of lies I have been told than to be in heaven worshiped by cherubim. But Jesus wants us to participate in our full inheritance. This is why we and others go back to our “drugs,” of different sorts. Our wiring pulls us to return to the darkness. We have to get used to the glory of God. It is easier to take rejection than awesome pure love. We are here to remind each other of our truth. Something in us wants to recoil the story, to say it is not this way.
Nicholas
This makes me think of suffering. Jesus endured a suffering. You need to be careful-there is this suffering you don’t have to be involved in where you are separating yourself from God. You can be present with someone in their suffering. You are suffering and you want to suffer…you don’t want help…you don’t want to be weak. This is a huge step gong to therapy. If you refuse, then you don’t admit you need help. There is a balance you need. Don’t suffer just because you hate yourself. It leads to a suffering that is inevitable. There is a de-valuing of yourself that causes suffering.
Efrian
Church teaches suffering is redemptive it you join it to Christ. To suffer just because of pain, they do it just to suffer.
Father Paul
Anyone who has a longing for suffering is twisted and sick. Anyone who prayed for Padre Pio to live longer, he considered his enemies. We stay true to the love and not the suffering, per se- in itself.
Ethan
The second Sunday of Lent is The Transfiguration. As we get ready to go into Lent, we can see the glory of God so that we can see the fullness of His love. We don’t just go in to suffer.
Father Paul
All lies are snapping. They are popping. As we stay with Christ, they keep popping. Ancestors and families start to get re-created as we move into these ways of love. There is an assembly we cannot see as we move in this way of love. It is all connected.
Krystal
Mother Teresa says love starts with a smile. It starts to open you up. It changes who you are in that moment.
Bethany
I think I have known this for years that the greatest impact I can have on people is not preaching or setting a good example, but growing in intimacy in Jesus.
Father Paul
Ding! Ding! Ding! That is the whole concept right there!
Josephine
“I appointed cherubim to guard you as slaves are guarded, but now I make them worship you as God. The throne formed by cherubim awaits you, its bearers swift and eager. The bridal chamber is adorned, the banquet is ready, the eternal dwelling places are prepared, the treasure houses of all good things lie open. The kingdom of heaven has been prepared for you from all eternity.”
Beth
That is what I heard that when we receive communion the angels adore us because we have received Him.
Father Paul
Jesus takes it real deep. The angels are adoring Y O U. We always want to deflect that they are adoring Him. He says, “No, they are adoring you!”
Bethany
Aren’t we worshiped because we are divinized in Him?
Father Paul
Yes, it is His divinity. They are worshiping Christ. He has become One with His bride. Don’t keep moving it back to Christ. Get back to full focus. If you don’t, the devil will steal your inheritance! Take your inheritance. Don’t take part [of it or] you will be enslaved again. Take the whole thing. What will they trick you with…some belonging…some affirmation…what can he trick you with? There is nothing else [if you take your full inheritance!]
Beth
Is part of the torment [of hell that] you realize what you have lost or what you could have had?
Father Paul
There are parts in me that I don’t really believe what Christ is doing in me. I am in my own little hell. So, we don’t want to speculate what others are experiencing in hell. I know when others are living in this kind of love, it affects people here and there. So, I think like Bethany said, the best way to experience it is to experience that love. St. Therese, The Little Flower stopped being a hero. She let Christ start living in her and in love with her. She was forgetting about other souls and experiencing this nuptial agreement directly. For me, it is much easier to go off and do something for the Lord than to encounter this intimacy and let is set me free and express itself. [ I have to be willing to] feel helpless and let this intimacy go through me and be ok with this feeling. What makes me “feel” better is to go back to the dungeon. [That is easier than to] stay in direct action and true intimacy. It makes me feel like I need to grab someone and go get tangled up again. Then I act like a brat to tangle myself again. You can be free to stay in love virtuously, morally, and simply in the kingdom of God. It doesn’t necessarily look like anything very interesting is happening.
Closing prayer.
Peace be with you! Please join us for the next meeting.
Monday, March 23, 2009
IN Christ
discipleshipmeetingatsaintandrew.blogspot.com
March 23, 2009 IN Christ
St. Andrew’s Discipleship & Bible Stories
Our introductory exercise this evening followed this format:
Pondering the Annunciation / Incarnation / Magnificat –
“God thank You for how wonderful I am, and God, thank You even more for how wonderful we are all becoming together – My name is : <Doug Logsdon from Alhambra, CA>; <Vincent from LAX>; etc.
Authentic spontaneity
The Ever Blessed Virgin Mary : My soul magnifies the Lord (proclaims the greatness of the Lord)
The FULLNESS of Her whole person is doing nothing but magnifying God –
<There was so much, Fr Paul, that you said on this and I wish you’d add more: I was (fingers couldn’t begin to keep up) zoned out in awe pondering/contemplating. But above is the substance. KRK>
Joseph breaking down the soul :
The soul is ONLY known by God: (we do not know the state of our own souls)
The perfect state of the soul is the union of the intellect (truth) and the will (good)
When we have union of intellect & will – we have Peace of Soul
Angels only have access to everything below the intellect and will (lower functions of the soul)
Concupiscence & irascibility (animal kingdom)
Imagination & memory
Before the Fall
(Original Sin of Adam & Eve)
perfect order (original Justice) higher faculties ordered the lower
Joseph drew a diagram for us:
God - Trinity
Mary
Angels – 1/3 fell -- 2/3 protecting us
Man
Animals
Plants
Matter
The only way to become Holy is to WILL IT – Charity/Love
AFTER THE FALL
Lower faculties in control of higher
Due to Fall the Intellect and Will are no longer in union
GRACE switches the triangle back right side up
1 Cor 15:45
Spirit – Soul : are these terms the same? No. Do the Scriptures distinguish them in any way? Yes.
45 The first man Adam was made into a living soul; the last Adam is a quickening spirit. |
The first Adam was a living soul; the last Adam [Christ] is life-giving spirit.
It is the Spirit that gives Life––Divine life.
Heb 4: 12
12 For the word of God is living and effectual, and more piercing than any two edged sword; and reaching unto the division of the soul and the spirit, of the joints also and the marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart. |
Hebrew: mind, heart, soul, spirit – one leader in a life-time –
(psycho) = mind not spirit
(pneumatos / πνευματόϛ = spirit)
Adam has a living soul
Christ – IS – a LIFE GIVING Spirit
God is Spirit – we worship God in Spirit and Truth by a disposition of Grace
There is a dispositional grace for us to start cooperating with
To move from grace to grace – this is development – growth “in Grace”
When Mary would receive another Grace she would ponder it in her Heart, and allow it to shape her – “Let it be done unto me according to Your Word” – don’t let me understand Your Word but let Your Word form me.
God’s Form-ation of our souls is compounding– as we cooperate with God’s Grace we are then ABLE to cooperate more
We practice natural virtues but we have infused supernatural Graces that accelerate our growth in natural and supernatural virtue – to grow into our inheritance – He wants to ACTUATE in us our potential, our inheritance
In Jesus Christ, in His natural life, His Divinity was hidden
Jesus Christ had the full unity of His Divinity and Humanity – bringing human nature into alignment with the Divine Will : Heb 5: 7-9 (Sunday 5th Lent)
7 Who in the days of His Flesh, with a strong cry and tears, offering up prayers and supplications to Him that was able to save him from death, was heard for His reverence. 8 And whereas indeed He was the Son of God, He learned obedience by the things which He suffered: 9 And being consummated, He became, to all that obey Him, the cause of eternal salvation. 10 Called by God a high priest according to the order of Melchisedech. |
Look in the Garden – if this cup …
Lk 22: 42
39 And going out, he went, according to his custom, to the mount of Olives. And his disciples also followed him. 40 And when he was come to the place, he said to them: Pray, lest ye enter into temptation. 41 And he was withdrawn away from them a stone's cast; and kneeling down, he prayed, 42 Saying: Father, if thou wilt, remove this chalice from me: but yet not my will, but thine be done. 43 And there appeared to him an angel from heaven, strengthening him. And being in an agony, he prayed the longer. 44 And his sweat became as drops of blood, trickling down upon the ground. 45 And when he rose up from prayer, and was come to his disciples, he found them sleeping for sorrow. 46 And he said to them: Why sleep you? arise, pray, lest you enter into temptation. |
(rest in Prayer and wake up in Prayer) –
Jesus is accustomed to prayer – get in touch with the REAL Jesus and get in touch with the reality we need to
Jesus needed to enter into deep, intense and frequent prayer – we read in Scripture: the He was in prayer – that He was all night in prayer
There might be a clue here
A watch in the night = 4 hours
Can you spend a watch (a soldier’s shift) – you’re only good for 4 hours – be with Me for a “watch” – “an hour” is calculated as “a watch” not 60 minutes but 4 hours
Jesus was used to stable, sober periods of alertness Himself – used to doing this in that Place (Garden of Olives, Desert, etc.) where He spent these big chunks of time
We don’t think we need to pray this way – that’s not a part of our life – or what we really think we need to do
We need to get very real about this – we act as if this were a metaphor – Christ is fully praying
– to stay in tune with and to advance in receptivity and readied capacity to what do as My Heavenly Father is doing – To be as my Father is being.
to stay in union in Spirit and in Truth – His faculties were edified, strengthened and consoled so that when He’s with a foolish St Peter – all His faculties need to be loaded in Prayer for these times – making more delicate and nuanced His faculties.
“His disciples followed Him … pray that you may not undergo the test… kneeling He prayed… Father if You are Willing… not My Will but Yours be done … He was in such agony … sweat drops of blood”
“Why are you sleeping ….”
I only do what My Heavenly Father is doing – if you want Me to do anything outside of that you’d better talk to the Big Guy
Our Lady says:
My soul … my spirit rejoices in God my Savior … lowly handmaid
The Almighty has done great things for me
His Mercy is from generation to generation
Dispositional graces – cooperates with those graces – God can DO wonderful things in her own nothingness – but God cannot do His Will in her without her cooperating -- her cooperation is allowing True Love to be occurring from her
We need a “personal trainer” – if your technique is a little off – you’re going to hurt yourself
– Our Lady is our personal trainer
Humility – what is humility : Virgin of Guadalupe look at her – magnificat
God WANTS to be glorified in Mary – God WANTS to be glorified in me –
Is it God’s will for me to be glorious with God’s glory
Without my trying very hard – let it be done unto me – it is HIS wonder – He looked on me in my nothingness (Mary)
Onus (burden) is on God – to glorify Himself in us
This will be easy and light (according to Jesus): “For My yoke is sweet (easy); My burden light” (Mt. 11:30)
Padre Pio – lower and higher aspects of soul
God wants us to be sharers in his divine self –
Only IS thee only ONE Christian – Jesus Christ
Ephesians 1:3 “In Christ” … “In Christ” … “In Christ” …. Is there a theme here?
Ephesians 1 Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ, by the will of God, to all the saints who are at Ephesus, and to the Faithful in Christ Jesus. 2 Grace be to you, and peace from God the Father, and from the Lord Jesus Christ. 3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with spiritual blessings, in Christ: 4 As He chose us in Him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and unspotted in His sight in Charity. |
We cannot become Christians – this entire Gift of Faith is all in Christ – we can insert ourselves into His own Christ-ian-ness –we always remain in Him as members of His ONE Christ-ness
The ONLY one Who will BE Good is God Himself – us in God in Christ – He is God He is God’s Will – Christ brought His Human Will into complete obedience – this obedience to His Will is part of who we are in Christ
We get all of the Jesus stuff in us – we do NOT have to be good with our own goodness. Then we cooperate with moral participation.
| Ephesians 1 Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ, by the will of God, to all the saints who are at Ephesus, and to the Faithful in Christ Jesus. 2 Grace be to you, and peace from God the Father, and from the Lord Jesus Christ. 3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who has blessed us with spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ:
4 As He chose us in Him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and unspotted in His sight in Charity. 5 Who hath predestinated us unto the adoption of children through Jesus Christ unto Himself: according to the purpose of His Will: 6 Unto the praise of the glory of His grace, in which He hath graced us in His beloved Son. 7 In Whom we have redemption through His Blood, the remission of sins, according to the riches of His grace, 8 Which hath superabounded in us in all Wisdom and Prudence, 9 That He might make known unto us the mystery of His will, according to His good pleasure, which He hath purposed in Him, 10 In the dispensation of the fullness of times, to re-establish all things in Christ, that are in heaven and on earth, in Him.
|
Movement and power of God in us – allow movement of Grace and cooperate with Grace IN Christ Jesus
“so that we might exist for the praise of His glory – have believed in Him – first installment
2 Peter 1:3
His divine power has bestowed on us everything that makes us Holy in Christ
Thru the knowledge of Him
He has bestowed on us precious and very great promises
A share in the Divine Nature
after escaping from the corruption of sin
We are NOT “meditating” to discover – that we are God
Only He has all the Virtues to handle that much glory – otherwise it incinerates us –
With, through and IN Christ we can handle that much glory
The Ever Blessed Virgin Mary had a little snapshot of it
We are saved, sanctified, glorified
Glorification – we show forth God’s own Glory and Divine Nature
NO creature can claim they are God – Mary is the Mother of God but not God
God wants to share the fullness of His Divinity – I Am Who Am – God – development of that progression is taking place
Most effective mode – divinization process – through the Church through the Sacred Liturgy - The Sacrament of “My” Body and Blood
Transforming power of the Eucharist – central Sacrament for nourishing that process
St Augustine paraphrase – This Bread wants to Eat you Alive and Divinize you
“I Am the Bread of Life”
May we come to share in the Divinity of Christ
His process is to take us into HIS Paschal Mystery; His dying and rising; Divinization through participation – this IS the central work of God to bring us into Himself
Titus 3:6-7
Titus 3:4 But when the goodness and kindness of God our Saviour appeared: 5 Not by the works of justice, which we have done, but according to his mercy, he saved us, by the laver of regeneration, and renovation of the Holy Ghost; 6 Whom he hath poured forth upon us abundantly, through Jesus Christ our Saviour: 7 That, being justified by his grace, we may be heirs, according to hope of life everlasting. |
BAPTIZED INTO CHRIST JESUS
we cease to be as we were – only human –
we are united in Him in His death – there goes your best excuse * down the drain
* “ I’m only human ”
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